The Project Infinite Podcast
A Podcast Spanning The Ever Expanding Infinite Multiverse of Fandom. From movies, to TV, to comics, to the world of gaming, we have you covered at every corner with thoughts, opinions, commentary and a little bit of comedy too.
The Project Infinite Podcast
131 - The Beau Demayo Controversy & The Boys Season 4 DEEP Dive
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We’re going back a few weeks to finally catch up on some things to review. This week we finish up talking about Season 4 of The Boys after taking on the first three episodes in a separate pod. Did this season suffer from being too WOKE? We also talk some Gamescom news and we tackle the controversy surrounding the dismissal of Beau Demayo from the X-Men 97 project, expressing empathy for the victims while reflecting on the broader industry impact. Timecodes are provided if you want to skip around to your topic of choice! Thank you to everyone who continues to support and don’t forget to subscribe to download new episodes as they become available and don’t be afraid to share a rating! Don't miss out on our comprehensive and engaging discussion!
0:00 Intro
02:04 Backyard Sports is BACK
06:13 Secret Levels in Development at Amazon
11:01 Pacific Rim Prequel Coming
14:05 The Acolyte & Book of Boba Fett Seemingly Cancelled
23:19 Discussing Beau Demayo’s Dismissal from Marvel Studios
37:26 Reviewing the Boys Season 4. IS IT TOO WOKE?
01:04:00 Okay Let’s Review The Season Now
01:36:40 Projecting Season 5
01:47:01 Awards Time! Favorite Scenes, Moments, Characters & Performances
02:04:30 Signing Off!!
Topic for Next Week: ????
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It's the Infinite Podcast. Go tell your friends. It's the Infinite Podcast. My journey never ends. It's the Infinite Podcast with Robin Korn for Q.
Speaker 2:Hello everybody and welcome to another episode of the Project Infinite Podcast, the podcast covering the infinite and ever-expanding multiverse of fandom, from movies, comics, tv shows, video games. We got you covered. I'm Rob, I'm here, as with Court, court, how's it going, man?
Speaker 1:Going great, going good, feeling great. You know who's not always feeling great, though Homelander.
Speaker 2:Homelander yeah, he's.
Speaker 1:Oh, sorry the Homelander. The Gambit the homelander, the gambit the punisher, the daredevils, um, yeah, so we the blades, the blade singular.
Speaker 2:Yeah, there's only ever been one blade, only ever gonna be one blade, um, yeah, so we are gonna talk about the boys this week. We're catching up on a bunch of stuff that, um, we hadn't got a chance to talk about because of Deadpool, wolverine, then Comic-Con, then D23 and yeah. So we did. Uh, what was it? Three weeks ago, we talked about episode no, it was more than that. Now it's like a month and a half ago at this point, we talked about, uh, episodes one through three of the boys when they came out all at once. So we'll talk about the rest of the season and then season four as a whole and then all the other stuff, obviously, that they have cooking up the pipeline, including, uh, the prequel series with jensen ackles and, um, uh, I forget the actress's name who plays stormfront off the top of my head right now and I believe we're still also getting that show.
Speaker 1:I think it's vaughn mexico or the boys, something like that. Yeah, the boys mexico.
Speaker 2:Or something like that yeah, with diego luna, and then obviously Gen V season two as well. So the Boys cinematic universe. They became the thing that they swore to destroy, essentially.
Speaker 1:Or maybe that wasn't the thing they swore to destroy. Maybe it was the thing that they swore to always make fun of. Yeah, and this is the only way that they can.
Speaker 2:By doing it Right. So we're going to talk about the Boys, season four. That's topic. Before that, we have some news, first and foremost Some news that's very near and dear to both our hearts. Obviously, gamescom is going on. There were some things. We'll talk about, a couple other things or one other thing that at least came out of Gamescom in a little bit, but the first one, backyard Sports, is back.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you thought the other thing that we were going to talk about was the important one. Nope, it's Backyard Sports.
Speaker 2:This I mean in the age of nostalgia. This is a series that myself and many, many others have been praying that would make its way into the modern era. For a long, long time it was a very popular. I know PC gaming is much different than it was in the 90s and early 2000s.
Speaker 1:PC gaming back then is go on your parents computer in the living room and game yeah, play like a little point and click right you know coolmathgamescom.
Speaker 2:I just unlocked a lot of core memories for a lot of people but now you knowa lot of people consider pc gaming to be like the peak gaming experience, because you can do so many things with mods and 12 monitors 18 fans unlocks.
Speaker 1:You know, unlocks key fuel it.
Speaker 2:Un do so many things with mods, 12 monitors, 18 fans, unlocks you know, unlocks, key fuel. It unlocks so many, you know, just so many features of modern games that consoles just aren't powerful enough to, because that's where PCs are at now. Henry Cavill obviously noted PC gaming enthusiast but yeah, backyard Sports was kind of a pinnacle of the early PC gaming iteration. Basically just took a bunch of original characters and gave them all little fun, little backstories and put them you'd play a season, multiple seasons, endless seasons, backyard Baseball being the most popular of all. The Backyard Sports spinoffs. Obviously there were iterations of Back baseball that came with mlb tie-in so you'd have like kid versions of like frank thomas and derrick jeter, ken griffey, um, mixing it up with these fictional characters.
Speaker 1:And now backyard sports is due for a comeback right, um, I hope this comes to consoles, obviously yeah, I mean it would be good you, you know I'm a big proponent of this too when they, when they go, don't overcomplicate anything. There's no reason to overcomplicate it Just refine the graphics obviously, have some fun for lack of a better term and update it with. You know a lot of the modern athletes Like there's so many modern athletes for whatever sport. I mean you go football. I think of guys like you know your Joe Burrows, your Justin Jeffersons. You go baseball, like your. You know your Aaron judges, your Juan Soto's, you go. You know you go basketball. I mean we can talk for days about how many NBA players there are that might want to be in this, but just have some fun, I just think. Have some fun and bring him back. He's like Thanos, yeah.
Speaker 2:Pablo Sanchez, the greatest, the greatest, uh, fictional athlete of all time. He's an issue Due to return as well.
Speaker 1:And yeah, like I said, I said that like it was like a Marvel movie.
Speaker 2:Pablo Sanchez will return. Yeah, I think this is great. Like you said, I don't think you overcomplicate things. I mean, I think NCAA 25 is a great example or College Football 25, I should say is a great example of, like you know, this dormant franchise and they just kind of returned with all the features and benefits that people loved and that game you know is doing really, really well.
Speaker 1:So I think backyard sports would do, would do the same right, yep, I'm in, I'm all the way and I think it's going to be super, super fun and I'll be there no matter what day one. Yeah, no matter what?
Speaker 2:yeah, same I'm.
Speaker 1:I'm already in how are we doing in college football 25? Who are you playing for?
Speaker 2:Clemson.
Speaker 1:Clemson.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:A little Davo Sweeney action, not bad.
Speaker 2:Yeah, a little Clemson action at this point with my road to glory. Nice quarterback receiver, what position? Running back, running back, yeah, oh, nice, nice, yeah. That game's a ton of fun, madden not so much.
Speaker 1:It's like what if we sprinkled a little bit of arcade-iness to this and didn't say and that's exactly what College Football 25 is?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I can't say enough good things about the game. I'm having a blast with it. I guess we could just talk about the game and having a blast with it.
Speaker 1:Um, I guess we could just talk about the other thing now I had to move down, but I don't know why I did it that way.
Speaker 2:Um so, amazon prime, um, you know, we talked about amazon prime being kind of like the I don't know, like the flag, the flag bearer for like video game adaptation properties. Um, at least that's how it seems, and they are doing something that I didn't even know they were working on, which is this animated anthology series called Secret Levels, and I'm not entirely sure. I've watched this trailer a couple times and I still don't totally know what it is.
Speaker 1:I'm kind of just confused. You know what I mean, but in a good way. Yeah, I'm intrigued.
Speaker 2:It's obviously a collaboration with multiple gaming studios.
Speaker 1:I wonder what it took to pull that off too, because that in and of itself is, like you know, a logistical nightmare.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, you gotta negotiate with all these studios to get the rights to their characters and such. So just a couple games that are gonna be represented in this thing Pac-Man, Warhammer, Mega man, Dungeons, Dragons, you know, slash Baldur's Gate is going to be represented, and then I guess the ones that everyone's talking about are the inclusions of the Playstation Studios characters of Kratos and Jin Sakai from Ghost of Tsushima.
Speaker 2:my goats, my kings throw Joel in there they said, and many, many more, it's going to be 15. I guess maybe an episode per franchise is what this seems like, cause it says it's going to be 15 stories, essentially, um kind of like a tales of the Jedi, like anthology series. So I don't know if there's any going to be, any like overarching um plots. What if, yeah, overarching plot, or if it's just going to be like this. I don't know. Like I said, like I don't really know what it is. I don't know if it's like a ready player, one sitch where like this kind of avatar, um, you know, audience surrogate character gets inserted into these video game universes, or or if they're like colliding, because there's like a screenshot of kratos in like a modern day city which obviously is not his, his bag, um, so I don't know.
Speaker 1:So it's who yet?
Speaker 2:I guess it'll be, I guess it's not. It's not yet. Curtis has to go to, like the store. Um, yeah, it's going to be animated. So obviously that unlocks a lot of um. You know that unlocks a lot of things that you can do, obviously, um, especially with. I just am super interested in what it's going to be. It comes out in December. I don't know if it's going to be an all-at-once sitch or it's going to be one a week or what it is.
Speaker 1:I think Amazon's kind of locked into the one-to-one. They're gaining Fallout because I think they knew that they needed the fan base to love Fallout, not only the fan base the non-fans to love Fallout. So I think they will go week by week. I think that would be cool and, especially from an anthology perspective, week by week makes a lot of sense. Sit with this for the week. Next week will be something completely different.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and obviously if you're going to do this they haven't announced any casting for this yet, but I would hope, if you're going to have these certain characters represented, that you would get the requisition the voice talent behind behind the characters you know. So I would you know if you're going to have kratos in this, obviously I would give christopher grud, christopher judge, a call um. Assuming that these characters are going to have speaking roles, I would hope that they would um instead of just silent.
Speaker 2:Oh, that would be terrible. If it's a flash sitch, like like kratos is just there, but like he doesn't speak, that would be terrible.
Speaker 1:Like you can't do this. Cage back you can't.
Speaker 2:You can't do that, um, but yeah, I'm super and it's also interesting because amazon's also doing the god of war series at some point maybe this is a little test, maybe.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's a great point, um, and then, yeah, I don't know what they're. I don't know what they're really. I don't think they have a relationship with the Ghost of Tsushima film. I think that's a different thing. So, yeah, like you said, I mean just the fact that they pulled this off feels like a logistical nightmare. I mean, it's kind of like Ready Player One in that respect that you have to get all the licensing and stuff for all these properties. So I'm intrigued at the very least, even though, if I don't know what it totally is, I'm intrigued at the very least, even though, if I don't know what it totally is, I'm keen to see more from it and more details from it. So that was really it from Gamescom.
Speaker 2:As far as major news Other than the Indiana Jones game that we talked about months and months ago is no longer going to be an Xbox exclusive. It will be releasing on PS5 in the springtime, whereas the Xbox version and PC version comes out in September. So a little bit of console exclusivity. We've seen, we've seen playstation do this before, um, with the final fantasy series, where they do like an exclusive period and then open it up. So, but I'm super excited for that. Um, as a ps5 owner, I was kind of I was a little bummed that we would be missing out on this indiana jones game with troy baker um voicing Indiana Jones. It's going to be very it feels like it's going to be very uncharted, um, you know kind of action adventure, and I'm now looking forward to being able to play it, me too.
Speaker 1:Me too, especially on that next gen graphic.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it looks great it's going to probably be it's.
Speaker 1:I think it's very fruitful too, but I think it's you know, the beauty of the pacific rim universe that you can kind of take it tonally where you want.
Speaker 1:Yeah, like I think there's a it's. There's this funny dichotomy between pacific one and pacific two where it's like one of these seems like it's like a studio movie and the other one seems like wait a second, there's some things in here, there's some ideas in here, so you can pick and choose how you want to go about this. This is going to be weird to say, but obviously you don't need to do the absolute cinema of what Godzilla Minus One did, but take some notes and understand, like what makes this such a, such a place where you can kind of play a little bit. And I think Godzilla minus one understands that funny enough as much as it's like you know these loud, dumb, big Hollywood action movies, like even the Godzilla franchise, like the, the, the live action one, they get it Like, they understand, and they evolved with the time, like it's not always going to be the gareth edwards. Let's just do cloverfield cinema now.
Speaker 2:It's like godzilla's or kong's riding on the back of godzilla fighting another red, like yeah fighting on ice monster like yeah, cares, yeah, and people love those things and I think you're right about like the. I think pacific rim was always right for a prequel, just because, um, story wise, you know, the first one takes place pretty far into the future of whatever this universe is.
Speaker 2:Like when you talk about, like the Jaeger program is kind of like, kind of like on the outs, yeah yeah, it's been there for so long and then they kind of like bring it back to, to to combat a new threat. So you could do a lot of things with it. You could do like the fall of humanity, you could do like the rise of the yeagers, like there's so many things that you could do with it, right chuck yeager john john yeager, john yeager um, shout out, bring each yourself back, but have him play.
Speaker 1:His ancestor plays. It's the thing where the ancestor plays the same.
Speaker 2:It's the same actor, I don't know how you beat the name, though I know he's named stack Stacker Pentecost.
Speaker 1:Oh man, it's John Pentecost.
Speaker 2:No, it can't be John Pentecost.
Speaker 1:Why it's John Yeager? Why can't it be John Pentecost?
Speaker 2:None of them can be, john, maybe.
Speaker 1:John Pentecost changed his name to John Yeager.
Speaker 2:That was the funniest thing that the God of War devs retroactively did when they technically canonized first name is john and he's john kratos nothing's ever gonna be. I'm john star john star wars star wars uh what were they cooking, I don't know. But uh, I mean, yeah, I think it's cool and there was for the longest time people were like clamoring for like a pacific rim, godzilla crossover I mean, I I think if kong didn't take the place there, there was probably a possibility that that could have been a thing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, instead of it just being Monarch, it was just.
Speaker 2:Also go check out the Apple TV Godzilla show with Kurt and Wyatt Russell because that show is crazy.
Speaker 1:That show is good.
Speaker 2:And what's her name? Isn't that Anna Soaizen? Oh yeah, yeah, Channel favorite, yeah yeah, yeah, so that's Pacific Rim Channel favorite. Yeah, yeah, yeah, so that's Pacific Rim. And then we have some Star Wars stuff and it's not good. None of it's good. So both the one, the one Book of Boba Fett hasn't been officially canceled. But Tamira Morrison does not sound very optimistic. I think he kind of knows.
Speaker 1:I think he knows. It's like I think Star Wars is making different moves. I mean, the news is that the Acolyte's been cancelled after one season, so the Dark Plagueis, plagueis reveal and the Yoda reveal are now the funniest things. The Dark Plagueis one is the funniest thing Because, like that episode totally was so different and some figure just started walking out of the shadows like Is that Newt Gunray Is?
Speaker 2:that Newt Gunray from Star Wars? No, it was Darth Plagueis.
Speaker 1:From Star.
Speaker 2:Wars.
Speaker 1:Also from the tragedy of Darth Plagueis the Wise, Darth Plagueis. From the tragedy of Darth Plagueis the Wise.
Speaker 2:I mean, I guess this isn't inherently surprising. No, it's unfortunate.
Speaker 1:It is unfortunate because also that might inform a lot and you know I'll even go further with that in a second just overarching star wars. But I think it's bad for the high republic stuff, especially because now you know, a lot of people probably aren't going to touch it. You know there's some people that are probably like where's the skywalkers? Like I know you guys, you guys know what you like and I mean it's just a.
Speaker 2:It's a. It's an unfortunate byproduct of, like, the streaming era, where I feel like a lot of these shows can't, they don't get enough room to get off the ground and I feel like if if, if cable tv had taken that approach with like their most popular series, like a lot of like what we think are like beloved shows, probably would have fallen by the wayside. You know, if they only got like a season to cook and then the networks were just like nah, right, like we're done, right um it's unfortunate.
Speaker 1:I mean, obviously we haven't talked about the show yet we had. You know, we both have some issues with the show. Um, we weren't the biggest fans of the show, and I mean to that point about a show needs to like if they only got one season, what's the thing that usually gets them past the seasons? It's the characters that you love. You think about these characters and like I need to see these people. I need to see more of them. Yeah, and that was this show's biggest issue is that?
Speaker 1:yes this show. Just I don't care about anybody in that show. It's technically good, looks good, sounds good, scores great choreography is incredible, I mean it's, it's the best lightsaber combat that we've seen.
Speaker 1:It just, it just is so to get the character work that you do in that show. It's frustrating I think that's the best term that I can use. It's like frustrating to see like them not flush out or flush out, but like characters that do. It's just motivations just don't make sense. Like I still don't understand the whole thing with with what's-his-name, with Sol. I still don't fully understand like the whole piece of what he wanted. I mean I'm not naive and like I get it, but I just don't under, I don't understand. I'm a big proponent of like you need to take it as what is instead of what you want, because you're not in the writer's room, but it still doesn't make too too much sense too yeah, I agree.
Speaker 2:I just think you know, and it was the you know, going back to when we first saw the trailer for it, I said on this podcast you can go back I don't know who knows what episode it was, but you can go back and say, like I said it, like it looks great, but like who am I supposed to attach myself to? You know, I'm not feeling a lot of like character work in these trailers and that was my kind of fear.
Speaker 1:I was hopeful that you you know, the show itself would kind of give us that yeah, but it really never did.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's probably some of the weakest star wars protagonists too with may and osha, like just never actualized of, because and I also like well, I should clarify, like not the performances weren't bad, yeah, the performances I thought were actually quite good.
Speaker 1:and I mean, um, my man from from I always forget his name, that was in the Good Place that plays essentially the villain of the show. He was solid, Like. I think he probably was the most interesting character, but Properly menacing too.
Speaker 1:Properly menacing, because it's like he lulled you to sleep with how charismatic he is, and then he's just like, oh, I can charismatic he is. And then he's just like, oh, I can, I can kill any of you with if and when I want. So I, I have no problem with this, but the two, I'm the two of them, it's may and ocean, they're just. I was thinking about this the other day, um, because I was doing some writing and I, I really want to ask a question to like a, like a, you know, a pro screenwriter about, like the mcguffin itself. Like there, I feel like there needs to be a line between the MacGuffin Like it's, the it's, it's kind of like the ideology. Can a MacGuffin be a person? Cause, like an ex Machina can be a person, but can the MacGuffin itself be a person?
Speaker 2:I think so.
Speaker 1:But there's, I think there's danger with that. The creator does that, Sure, sure, sure, but I but it's not the main character that does it. Yeah, it's not, it's not the main character of the show. That's why I said like the main character, not the main character, but there's usually this side character, this wise, old, sage character, whoever you want to make, it's like they can be the ex machina, but the macguffin, being a person, is a difficult piece and the creator does what this show doesn't do, because it makes me care about alfie immediately. Um, not only you know as a character, but lore wise, it makes me care about alfie like the show. Right, it's predicated on me caring about ocean may in the same way, probably even more so than the creator did. But they just you're.
Speaker 1:You're bogging it down too much with all this soul stuff and all this, like you know, the lore not being. It feels like it's like. It feels like there was like contention almost like they wait.
Speaker 2:I think they. In my opinion the show waits way too long to to do the reveals. Yeah, they hold all of those reveals almost like the finale and by the time you like, by the time you get to them, like you don't get a lot of them to breathe, right like you revisit that moment with the witches, so many so, and you kind of get the sense that Sol did it, but you don't get the confirmation until the end of the show and then he dies.
Speaker 1:And then again, man, I can't believe they did that to Koganada, because I believe Koganada even said he's always been a Star Wars fan. I mean, he is a phenomenal filmmaker and he has the two worst episodes of this show, like and it. It's so frustrating because, like I love that guy and his, his sense of you know, he has this sense of like ambience in his filmmaking too, and this is probably the one show you can use that for. You can use that to the advantage of, like, just letting things breathe, and they just don't. They just don't know how to do it, they just don't know what. They just don't know how to execute it. Like I kept seeing it, like I can't believe coconauta did these episodes like it wasn't. I promise you it wasn't him. He directed those two episodes like he was probably. It's, it's probably my chloe xiao theory for the eternals yeah, yeah, 100, yeah I would.
Speaker 2:I would agree with that. Um, and then, you know, as far as the Book of Boba Fett's concerned, I mean I'm not terribly surprised we're not getting a second season of that. I mean, that show ends. You know, the last three episodes are essentially a continuation of the Mandalorian anyway, and I mean when we reviewed it, we still we were like stunned.
Speaker 1:I still cannot believe in a show with one of the most legacy characters in kind of fiction, boba fett, that it gets taken over by somebody else in it. He, how do you not show up in your own show? For two out of the seven episodes you're not in the show.
Speaker 2:That's absurd and I feel bad. I mean I feel bad for tamir morrison too, because you could tell, I mean he has a real, real attachment and affinity for his role in the star wars universe, not just as boba fett, obviously, yeah, as rex as Boba Fett, obviously but as Rex, as Jango Fett, so you know, as John Star Wars, john Star Wars.
Speaker 2:So you know, I hope that this isn't the end of his tenure in that universe. You know, hopefully he kind of can latch on to. You know, ahsoka, I guess. Now I don't know if he's going be in the the movie. You know, that movie that feloni's doing, that's like the avengers there's no earthly shot.
Speaker 1:You don't get tomorrow morris to not be in that movie like there's. No, I don't see him. I see many possible futures, as paul travis would say I don't see a future where he's not in that movie, as, whoever it doesn't, it's probably gonna be rex yeah, I don't think he would come back as boba fett at this point.
Speaker 2:Yeah, definitely be rex um. And then, yeah, I mean it's just unfortunate for him, it's unfortunate for mcnaught, when I really enjoyed um her character. So maybe, I don't know, she can pop up, maybe in the mandalorian.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that would make a lot of sense in the mandalorian grogu yeah, why is that a movie?
Speaker 2:I'm just calling it the mandalorian right.
Speaker 1:I don't know should have just been season four of of the mandalorian um, and then you know it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but also at the same time, like it's not the, it's not an acolyte situation where I feel like boba's plot was not resolved I feel like I feel like if that was to be the end of it, I think where he ends up, it kind of makes sense and we don't necessarily have to see him again you know, your approach to that show probably should have been more episodic than overarching.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the way I was thinking about it. Because like just do, like the supreme, like just do the trials and tribulations of him being a crime, boss of boss eisley, like yeah just kind of do it week to week, probably extend the season.
Speaker 2:Two more episodes, so instead of, or two to three episodes, so instead of seven you do nine to ten well, we could talk about that when we talk about the boys too, because I think that's more of an overarching point with these shows recently. I think House of the Dragon also kind of suffers from this A bunch of shows do, so we'll talk about that when we talk about the Boys. And then the last thing that we will talk about before we have to talk about the Boys and it's a doozy. So this is the. I guess this is kind of the final. It may not be the conclusion, but at least we're in the final act of the Bo DeMaio conspiracy mystery of what happened between him and Marvel.
Speaker 2:Obviously he was let go before the release of X-Men 97, under circumstances by which no one knew. For months he was regularly tweeting about the show, interacting with fans about the show while it aired. So we were like what? Marvel didn't put any kind of constraint on him to talk about the show. So we're like what could he have done? Um, there were, you know, rumblings of, you know people wanted to bring him on, you know for for other things x-men related, and we're like, well, let's wait and see Um, cause obviously he was fired for some reason. We just don't know what it was Um. Then there was the thing last week that came out that he was not invited to the um, like the X-Men 97 contingent um for the Emmys to accept, you know, if they win an award. Um, he was not invited to go, um. And then he put out some cryptic thing about, like I'm not surprised, but I'm working with Marvel or speaking with Marvel, about you know something. Um, and then the. I guess the straw that broke the camel's back was essentially, he was removed from the from credit for season two, of which we know that he you know they confirmed that he, that he, he wrote season two, but his name has been struck from the from the writer's credits, right, um. And he then put out a tweet saying basically, like it was a retaliation from marvel because he posted some type of gay pride you know thing on instagram and he felt it was retaliatory. And then marvel was like all right, um, you know, it's enough. Like, enough is enough. Um, we're gonna basically put out the reason you were let go now, um, and it was a bunch of really bad stuff which I mean you could have supposed. Based on everything that happened and how quickly it happened. You, you had a feeling that it was pretty substantial.
Speaker 2:And then it turns out it was um, a, a lot of sexual misconduct, um, in terms of, like you know, sending provocative sexually explicit photos to staff members, um, using said sexually explicit photos as inspiration for potential inspiration for X-Men 97,. Um, sexually, you know, abusing staffers and coworkers. Um, you know, uh, using, you know abusing staffers and co-workers. Um, you know, uh, using, you know, language that that shouldn't be used in the workplace. And then apparently, this, this was also a similar pattern of behavior that he, he was, um, exhibiting when he was working on the witcher. Um, and that was never, it was never investigated or looked into.
Speaker 2:Um, and and the marvel pretty much just like dropped the, dropped the nuke on him and it was like it felt like I didn't, for whatever reason. They felt, maybe it was like a contractual thing, maybe they felt beholden to not put this out there to potentially ruin this guy's career. Um, and then you know he put out that tweet about potentially feeling like he was being removed from season two because of some type of gay pride post. And then Marvel was just like all right, now we got to kind of you're, you're kind of coming at us. So we got to come at you now and you know I don't know what this future holds for him, but it, you know it doesn't look promising.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, the first and very foremost thing that I'll say is like I feel so, so bad for anybody that you know had to deal with this alleged, not alleged but who had to deal with this sort of for lack of a better term like brain that he had, like any staffer that had to, you know, be beholden to whatever he was doing. Like that's just disgusting and I'm sorry that they have to, that they had or have to deal with anything like that or, you know, be associated with him in any way after that too. It's just it's not fair. It's just not fair to them. Like, imagine in hollywood, such this tough place to get into. Imagine like you work all this time and like these are the type of people they warn you about, like that could be there. And then you know you get on this great project and you know it's, you know this charismatic person's there and it's just like hey, like we're gonna bring the x-Men back to light and really all things, all behavior aside, a really brilliant creative mind.
Speaker 1:Exactly. Yeah, I mean somebody that's using real-world experience to really resonate for exactly what the X-Men were. Before we knew what he did. This is something we were saying week in, week out. He did like this is something that we were saying week in, week out. Like his understanding for the x-men is like on almost on like chris claremont level of like we understand exactly what the x-men are and like the hate they receive for no reason. Like it's like we understand. Like I understand all those things. And then just great storytelling on top. Like you're talented on top of that too. So it's what a waste to you know to be the type of person that you are. On top of it, it's just, it's sickening.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and it's just you, just you just don't have to do it. Like you don't have to engage in that behavior. Like you know, obviously we're not wired that way. So like we don't know what goes through a person's mind who engages in behavior like that. Just do your job, just be there, what you're paid to do, right. And like, just man, it just it's great. And you know, the unfortunate thing too is like if all this was happening, you know, while he was, you know and and and he knew, and everyone knew why he was Lego, but then at the same time, like kind of putting himself on this pedestal, right, I'm like look at me and like this thing I created, knowing full well, like you're never gonna get to do it again, right? So like that, that also is retroactively very confusing and a bit selfish as well too, yeah yeah, I agree, because you know the people that he worked with have to.
Speaker 2:You know, I know a lot, a lot of them had been had been tweeting along with the show, like a lot of the animators and such had been tweeting along with the show.
Speaker 2:I think that's really great, but like, for them to like watch him also do that is just kind of like you know it's. It's a little like you said, it's a little selfish and it's a little like self-grandizing, like a little disgusting to like do that and it's just you know, you know I I can't say we didn't ask for this, yeah sure, sure, and you know, I think about the James Gunn thing of you know he was let go at some point and then we were kind of saying like we knew what he did.
Speaker 1:And then Disney made a decision. They said like hey, like, second chances are a thing, redemption's a thing. And somebody made a point about the Robert Downey. It was more of like you know, robert Downey Jr. And then the Jonathan Majors thing. Like it was something Jonathan Majors was saying a couple of weeks ago where he said like hey, I'm happy that Robert Downey Jr Is getting his thing. And like the TMZ reporter asked him, like are you upset? He's like, yeah, I'm upset. Like yeah, yeah, this is a sad thing. Like yeah, this was my character. And like, essentially, that was my universe to take, like that was my, that was my throne to take and now I'll, I'll never have it. Um, but he said like in the future, like maybe, like I'll get my second chance, just like how Robert Downey Jr Did.
Speaker 2:But I think, I think that's entirely possible. You know, for Jonathan majors. You know, at the end of the day, like it sucks as a writer for me to say this, but like he's just a writer, like he's not, he's not an actor, he's not like on screen, he's not a director. Like there's really no reason to. You know, try to take a second chance on him. Like writers are like a dime a dozen I mean I'll even counter but agree.
Speaker 1:But I'll say like I think great writers are difficult to come by, like a writer like that of what we just got, of what we were like we were not just us, I mean, almost everybody was like, well, we know who's gonna take the mcu x-men, like we don't have to think about it, it's both of my. Like you don't even have to think about it, you have your, you have your, your, your heir to the throne. Essentially like, yeah, put him with the james guns, ryan coogler boat.
Speaker 2:Like, and now it's like I hope he, you know, after this, I hope he never gets anything again, like if you really made people feel that way you shouldn't get anything and I know, like the robert downey jr point, like people tried to, like you know, draw comparisons and I just don't. A it's not fair, because robert downey jr was was engaging in self-destructive behavior exactly, and b it took robert downey j.
Speaker 1:A really long time to get out of that. It was through the 90s and then up until Zodiac was his first one where he was back Up until 2005,. 2006 for him to be.
Speaker 2:It took him a really long time, and when we talked about Iron man in one of our episodes, it was really Jon Favreau that pushed and pushed and pushed. Marvel did not want to touch Robert Downey Jr.
Speaker 1:Let's even go further with that. That was a Paramount production. If that was a Disney production, I actually would promise you Robert Downey Jr wouldn't have been Iron man if it was Disney that had the reins at that time.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I mean it took Robert Downey Jr almost 20 years to to get out of that hole and that wasa hole. That was wholly so. I mean, obviously, you know, being an addict, being an alcoholic, has effects on those around you not, but also, you know, the biggest, you know, ultimately the biggest person that it affects is yourself. So he was engaging in this incredibly self-destructive behavior that you know, then, in turn, afflicted everyone around him because of his status, you know, as as a major actor.
Speaker 1:You know, and then you hop over to the like the jonathan major situation, like that's like physical abuse at that point, so that's like again like robert denny. He again it's self-destructive behavior that ripples outwards. But like jonathan, major situation is different because that's physical abuse which is just never accepted. And then there's Beau DeMaya. Like that's sexual abuse, like just never accepted. Like unfortunately for Beau DeMaya, which just it's clipped. I don't see him ever working again like after this.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and especially you know that similar behavior was also exhibited when he was working on the Witcher.
Speaker 1:Yeah, exactly, so it's not like he learned.
Speaker 2:He learned a lesson.
Speaker 1:I think that one witcher writer kind of said like he's like a, he's like he's always been like this, like he even on there, it's like he's like almost, like victimizing himself to get more almost is kind of what he was saying which is kind of how it reads, especially, like I said, especially after, you know, doing the live tweeting of x-men 97 and and keeping himself as almost like a sympathetic figure.
Speaker 2:Because, you know, and people, obviously people would ask him, like, while he was live tweeting, like what happened?
Speaker 2:And he would go, you know the, the story will come out or whatever, like you know, yada, yada, and then he just it did feel like a pattern of like this, this, this self-sympathy, yeah, behavior.
Speaker 2:And then, like I said, eventually, like when, that, when the, when this latest thing happened, where, where he was removed from season two credit, and he felt or he tried to spin it as retaliation for a gay pride post, and marvel was just like enough is enough.
Speaker 2:Essentially, like that's really how it felt to me, like it really felt like marvel was withholding this, you know I mean, which is also kind of like shitty on their part. Like that they withheld, you know, because, like what would happen if they never put this out and he got another job and did the same thing? You know what I mean. Like, so you know, in a way, like it's kind of crappy that Marvel also withheld this from from everybody until now, from everybody until now, um, but yeah, I've got. They must have felt they were, you know, backed into some type of corner, because I think they also felt like the groundswell of like fans just trying to, not trying to bring him back, but like kind of pushing marvel to like hire him back, hire him back, and marvel's like we can't, but we're not going to tell you why we can't, but we can't.
Speaker 1:And, like I said, like without the james gunn thing, I don't think it would have been this many like roars to bring him back, but like you already did that for possibly your most important creator that you've had in that universe, singularly, like a singular person to kind of have influence over something, yeah, like if he never came back, then bodem, I like we would have never even thought about like bring him back for anything. But now it's like maybe, like again to our like we kept saying it week in, week out, especially after episode five, where, like what did he do? Like he this, he understands he's just a dang good writer. Like what did what did he do? Like this is like a generational writer. That's just being like told, no, but now we know, and good riddance.
Speaker 2:Unfortunately, yeah, exactly yeah, there's no, yeah, there's no, yeah, there's no, really really no reason to try and defend it or try and bring him back for anything at this point, like that was that was always the conceit that you and I both shared like, look, we don't know what he did, and if you know, if it's something this severe like, then we don't want him to come back.
Speaker 2:Um, but until we know, we, we have to recognize the immense talent that you know is coming together. And then you know, now, we, now we know what we know, um, that's really the end of it. And you know, you know, hopefully, you know, hopefully there there are better angels in that room working X-Men 97, that kind of absorbed, you know, the talent that he did have and absorbed his kind of cause. He obviously still has a love for the X-Men I mean, I can't be disputed. So hopefully, you know the better angels in that room, absorbed all of that and can keep that, you know, keep that quality up, you know, with him, with him not being there, um, which I think is entirely possible. I think that.
Speaker 2:I think that you know it's a writer's room, it's not just one person writing the whole thing yeah, so I I I still have high hopes for it, um for for season two and beyond of that show.
Speaker 1:I just hope ultimately like and this is the thing, this is the thing that always comes from this like is the black cloud gonna reign over this show permanently? And in this and you know, I said it and I will keep saying, this is a top three project marvel has ever done in the mcu like top three, maybe not even two or three like this is one of the greatest things that they have ever done. And now it's gonna have something over. It's gonna it's the, it's gonna have the asterisks next to it until the end of time, unfortunately, and that's that's the true fear, especially going into like a season three. Like man like you, I wish they didn't have to worry about something like this because, like you, would just want the show to be great and like, especially the modern age of marvel.
Speaker 2:Like of course something happened, like of course there has to be something with this yeah, yeah, it's true that we kind of talked in the past how they've been kind of snake bitten since, since endgame with with a variety of things you know.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, I, I totally agree, um, but let's, let's pivot, let's pivot and talk about the boys, pivot, um, yeah, let's talk about the boys and the end of season and mid to end of season four, because obviously we talked about, um, the first three already, so you can go back and listen to that. So, um, yeah, I mean, you know the point I was going to make earlier about the streaming thing, like I just I think we're at a point where, like, I think these, these studios just either need to, you know, they need, I think they need to open it up a little bit. I think they need to. I think the eight episode model is a little becoming a little antiquated at this point. Um, I think this show doesn't. I don't think the show suffers from it as much as other shows, but I think it still suffers from it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm like 50-50 on that point. The only reason I'm 50-50 is because a show with this material is very it needs to be shot. You know what I mean? It can't be long form for something like this. And I'm going to get to a point about how my brain's just desensitized at this point because I re-watched I told, remember I was re-watching the whole show before season four came out and like I'll never forget what was the first big thing. Obviously the Robin thing is like what, the? And then you're like you keep watching because you were so used to one thing, you're used to like one way of making superhero content. And then you get that and you're like what? The? Like, what happening?
Speaker 1:Like I'm watching season four and season four has some of the worst things that the voice has ever done. It might have two of the absolute worst things that this show has ever done. And I'm sitting there I'm like, yep, this is normal, but like still, still to that point, like I think something with like that much graphic nature to it needs it can't be longer than this. I don't think it needs to be any longer than this. I think it's the and none of the other seasons have suffered from this, so I I can't sit here and be like well, it needs to be. Like season three is the best season in the show I think we can both agree on. Like season three didn't have a problem with this.
Speaker 2:I think I guess the only the only difference between, say, a season three and this is this it feels like it does feel like a little bit like the show. Is this show this season, more than the others, felt more wheel spinning than the others? Um, in terms of you know how many times are we gonna get to the doorstep of them getting rid of homelander? And then he just gets away again.
Speaker 2:Well, until because you know, I think kind of one of the not mistakes that eric kripke made, but he, he had always said from the beginning that this was like a five season thing, and then he kind of, and then he reneged on it slightly and then it was kind of like a joke. He was like no, I'm kidding, like it's, it's five, five seasons. So like I feel like season four was always going to be the one that that kind of suffered like just from the jump, just naturally, I mean the pen. When you know and ultimates are tough, like when you know what the, when you know what the end destination is, like it's kind of hard not to look to the end destination yeah, we talked about it with game of thrones.
Speaker 1:Like the one of the most difficult things you have to do is set up is probably the in writing terms. Like, because was listening to to Mazin talk about it on his podcast. On his podcast he was like the setup is so difficult because, like you oh no, sorry, I was talking I was listening to the Script Apart podcast and I think I was listening to Fallout and he said, like one of the writers for Fallout said, like when you're writing, like and you know you have what you want, just write what you want and worry about the setup later. Like, don't worry about the setup now, just get to the point where you want. So, like, if the whole season is the point of the setup, that's where your difficulty comes in, where you're like, how do I structure this? Like, what do I give, what do I take?
Speaker 2:They just did it with House of the.
Speaker 1:Dragon too.
Speaker 2:House of I just did this where, where, you know, one of the complaints of season two was that it felt like a setup for season three and, and I think you know and we talked about it when we talked about that in that podcast like I think that show, even though a lot of it was set up for season three, still set up individual arcs for season two that paid off in the finale, which made the finale retroactively make sense. Whereas like, whereas like in the boys, nobody's arc really nobody. Nobody's arc starts in this season and ends conclusively in the season, except maybe butcher. Like butcher gets a little bit, a little bit more kind of additive to like his character, whereas, like all the other characters besides I mean a train obviously too but all the other characters kind of stay roughly the same and nobody really gets a definitive conclusion to their season four arc unless they were killed obviously and unfortunately there's a big offender which hurts this for and it's huey like yeah, yes, unfortunately lost our, our pov character.
Speaker 1:He was the, he was the, he was us, he was the one. And that's my thing about the maybe this was intentional to my point about, like me, resonating with the gore anymore and the graphic nature.
Speaker 2:Because Huey's also desensitized.
Speaker 1:And they actually make the point about it. So maybe that was the point and maybe I can actually give them credit, and maybe I just thought about this and then they're going to be like you're right.
Speaker 2:You're right on.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we did think about this, wink, wink, we did always think about this, but like, like on a serious note, like hugh man spoilers, I guess. But yeah, when huey was talking, like right before butcher walks in and murders, um, murders newman, like huey talked about, he's like guys, we need to find a good way to do this. Like when it's like the last, most part. Two thing, like we need to end this cycle of violence. And then butcher, immediately he's like absolutely not, this is not how this is not how this world works. And he was just standing there each season like again, each season he was covered in blood. Each season. There's purpose to that. Like he doesn't feel it anymore. He's just like I'm, I'm numb, like I don't, I have no feeling left anymore.
Speaker 2:Especially a character that you know, a Newman, that Huey had like some type of relationship with too. And he even still, like you know, obviously he's kind of he's shocked, right, but he's not. But he's not like, oh my God, Like what the hell did you do? Like it, just like no one tries to stop him.
Speaker 1:Yeah stop him. Yeah, like he just. I mean, I don't know how you do stop him right. Well, like I said, and like a, that's more for like a, you know, thematically and tonally for the show, I'm talking more like character wise for the show. Like you lost your main character, like you essentially lost the person that we have been following this whole time with purpose, even down to season three.
Speaker 1:Like to see how many and like you look season to season, like season one is like to see how. And like you look season to season, like season one is like that shock factor of like now you're getting dropped into this world and like finally you get to see the veil versus season two's, like alright, we're gonna try a different way. And then season two's more, you're never getting out of this. Like you can't escape this. You're in it now. Like you can't. Season three is I need the power that they have. Like I, I need it. Like I, I'm nothing. And like my girlfriends in the seven, like I have the most powerful man on the planet wanting me dead. Like I, I need power myself. And then you get to season four and it's like you lost all the things. That was pulling Huey along and then pulling the plot along.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, I mean the biggest, obviously the biggest things that I mean. Unfortunately, the arc with his dad kind of gets lost in the shuffle because it happens in episode four and five essentially.
Speaker 1:Which is funny, because that's probably one of the most beautiful pieces of the entire show.
Speaker 2:Like I feel like maybe you could have pushed that plot a little further to the end of the season that way, because a lot of stuff happens between when Hugh's father dies to the end of the season. So like by the time you get, and like you know, it kind of like like hugh gets a lot of like, like a lot of stuff happens to him. But I feel like it it happens in such quick succession that you're just like you're almost like like kind of your point, like you're kind of desensitized to it. Like what happens to him in in the tech night episode is horrifying it's.
Speaker 1:I like I said like herogasm on paper is the worst thing that show has done.
Speaker 1:It's herogasm yeah orgasm probably does not even come close to what they did to huey in in that last episode. I mean, huey was sexually assaulted multiple times this season and again taking him out of the main character spot makes it like, oh well, like that's actually how they kind of play it for huey, and like taking him out of the main character spot makes it like oh well, like that's actually how they kind of play it for huey, and like we'll talk about the starlight thing of like from like a writing lens, of like wow, like obviously this whole universe is supposed to be where like people aren't like but annie's supposed to be like that's why they work so well. You know, like huey's supposed to be the good out of out of like the normal people, it's supposed to be the good out of the soups and Annie being like Hughie's just assaulted and Annie's just like wow, I can't believe you were with her and I'm like he was just assaulted, he thought it was you. Why would he not think it was you?
Speaker 2:Yeah, that whole thing I didn't really resonate with or really understand it. Especially, like you said, her character to this point had never been that person, right. So I don't know if it's part of her story. As far as she was kind of, she was pushed to the brink this season with the whole firecracker thing and the abortion angle, having her private business thrown out in public. So that could have been part of it. But like at the same time, like when you're talking about whether it's a book or a tv show, like at a certain point, like yeah, you're supposed to make some suppositions as a viewer or reader, but at the same time, like the show or book also has to kind of give you a little bit you know into, and so they do have to do some legwork and give you why a character is reacting a certain way, instead of you just kind of supposing it and then you know it felt very like sitcom-y like that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and it was such a small beat that like it lasted for like 20 minutes in the episode and then she was just like, all right, we're back to the, we regress back to the mean. But it was like, why are we even thinking about this right now? Yeah, also in a finale. Why are we thinking about it?
Speaker 2:In the age, in the age of, you know, accessibility and technology that we're in, where these, these writers and these showrunners can can hop on Twitter like the minute after the episode ends and goes no, this was actually our intention. Like lazy in the actual delivery. Like you know, notorious, awful human being, jk rowling, was like the biggest offender of this um, as, as the harry potter books came out and then, you know, as we got into the age of the internet, like she would retroactively like add lore like to the harry potter stories. Like you know, the whole dumbador being gay thing, like she was. Like she was like no, actually, that's true, instead, but like put that in the in the story. Then, instead of telling us retroactively and I feel like that, the age that we're in now with the internet, like kripke does this all the time with the boys where he's like well, he did it with the with the huey thing, when he was like no, actually, that was the point was to drop. Like you know, do it for not a laugh, but do it, you know, make it not, as you know, make the characters not react as strongly as as you feel like they should have.
Speaker 2:Like you, I shouldn't need you coming out and telling me these things. For me to absorb it, it's almost like it's almost like dlc for for a tv show. When, like a character with like a you know that's that's, you know video games suffer from, like the dlc problem, we're like, no, we're actually going to give you a, a 20 expansion. That that enhances the story. I'm like, well, why do you like this was 30 years ago. You would have just given me that. Now it's like the same thing with, like tv shows. Like, well, I can, I can put, I can write a plot hole into my story, but like, because you know, five minutes after the episode airs, I can hop on twitter and explain my plot hole. Like that, you should just fill the plotothole in the beginning to begin with, right?
Speaker 1:right this season. Okay, let's get it out of the way. This season's woke, this is the most yeah, this is the most.
Speaker 2:It's the most heavy-handed. It's the most heavy-handed it's been with it the jokes the jokes on my side.
Speaker 1:This is well this season's woke. Is this play about us like yeah?
Speaker 2:yeah, this is the most overt the show's been.
Speaker 1:Yeah on a serious note, this is the most real world informed season that they've had so far. You know, on purpose, very, very much on purpose, down to actual dates of actual key events in us history. You, oh, I said us history, as if this wasn't in the last four years as if it wasn't three years ago. Yeah, uh, but us history like taking place like this is actual actualities of the entire.
Speaker 2:So much so that they had to change the the episode title of the finale because of real world events that transpired literally the weekend before the finale.
Speaker 1:That was crazy not only the boys, but falcon, or falcon and the winter soldier. But uh, captain america, brave new world also had to change some things. While the trailer was in theaters, they had to change some things. While the trailer was in theaters, they had to change some things. This season is woke. It's woke Just kidding. It's not Because that's not a real thing. Sorry If I offended anybody. Woke is not a real thing, but this season is the most informed. This season is the most. It takes to direct comparison from overthrowing a government.
Speaker 1:Let's see what the USA has done in the last four years. Hey, I need like the montage music overthrow a government, storm the capital. What else do we have?
Speaker 2:I mean, we have the whole, uh, you know pro-life, pro-choice, you know issue right becoming a political thing, right, um, you have the inflammatory, you know, via the firecracker character. You have the inflammatory media personality who doesn't 100 believe the things that she's spewing, but does it because the viewers are easily manipulatable, stealing an election yeah, assassinating a president it's almost like the show is.
Speaker 1:What is this? Is this show trying to talk about what actually is happening?
Speaker 2:yeah, how dare they do that?
Speaker 1:Yeah, how dare the show. That's always been about that since season one. Try to do that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I mean the only difference between this season and the other seasons is they're so close now to the real world stuff To the sense that they're not.
Speaker 1:I'm going to hold any sort of my political affiliation or thoughts on that, because, yeah, that's the, that was the point. Oh yeah, yeah, and it's not. Oh, let me rephrase, it's not the point.
Speaker 2:It's just very weird that we got there and we were talking about a television show right yeah, that's all I'll say on that yeah, yeah, exactly, and it's like the point, like the point being like. Now it feels like and and I think I forget who it was, it might have've been Anthony star who mentioned this that like they they wouldn't be talking about his relationship with Metro booming.
Speaker 2:Um, they wouldn't be able to do what they do if the real world inspiration wasn't so insane to the sense that, like we shouldn't have to draw from all these insane things, because these insane things shouldn't be happening, but they are, so why wouldn't we draw on them?
Speaker 1:like the real world has become the universe that they established and people are acting like this is some grand revelation and this grand woke agent. This has been happening since season one of this shit. Since the first five minutes of this show it's been happening like that the corporate, the corporatization of you know public figures, like we know some public figures, some actors that are like push this person for any little lasting that you can get. Like, no matter what they've done, what they've said, mark Wahlberg would, no matter what they've happened, they're gonna be pushed for things like that's the, that's the point. Like it's like I don't know, uh, the the storm front thing is that's a big one. Like I don't know if you guys know, but there were nazis marching in the streets in the last, in the last eight years of this country. Like that's real, that's like these are real things that I like I don't know why this season was the one where people's brains turned on.
Speaker 2:They were like oh no, I mean even going down to like yeah, obviously, homelander is an analog to Donald Trump. Like, obviously, but you know, step stepping outside that. Like public, you know these public, famous figures being used for political means. Like Hulk Hogan was just speaking at the Republican National Convention. Like that that's the same thing as Homelander standing behind the president at the end of, at the end of the season. Like it's the same. It's the same thing.
Speaker 2:Like you know, he doesn't have I mean, he has power, but he doesn't. He shouldn't have, homelander shouldn't have any political sway, but he does because he's. He's a notable figure, like the populist nature of of that universe, and this one in the, in the sense that, like these, these people who have no business being in the business that they're meddling in, are there because of their notoriety. Right, and that's exactly what the show is commentating on. Like Homelander shouldn't be anywhere near the white house, but he is because, a he's physically the most powerful person in the world, but B he's the most famous person in the world, but b he's the most famous person in the world, and that's the point.
Speaker 1:Like homelander's on every t-shirt there's places named after homelander, homelander's taught at schools, like all those things. Like this is real, this is real stuff.
Speaker 2:Yeah, exactly and I can't believe the boys is woke always was yeah, and, like I said, I think the the probably the only difference is is how close to everything that they're paired, that they're satirizing, is happening but again, you just made the absolute one of the best points you've ever made on here.
Speaker 1:I can't imagine that. We got that close. How did we, as like a people of this country, get that close to that? It's not like they're pulling this stuff out of this stuff. Actually real life happened yeah, in the last four years.
Speaker 2:And that's the thing that makes people angry they feel like it's politicizing it.
Speaker 1:Oh shut up. You watch Star Wars. Shut up, shut up. That's all what Star Wars had ever been about, since the beginning. If you like Andor and you want to make that point, I hope you know what Andor was talking about. I hope you exactly know exactly what they were talking about.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, the only difference between Andor and the boys is, you know, I think people Andor's in space, so it's make-believe. And the boys is satire. Exactly Like the boys is satirization. Exactly the nature of satirization is we're going to directly reference this thing that we're satirizing, because that's what makes it satire so like if you, if you storm the capital, we're going to put a storm the capital bit in our show because it's a satire, like we have to. The the boys is not the place for metaphor right, like I need.
Speaker 1:You got to hit me in the face with it and for, like, that's the point that's the nature of satire, like they're gonna use.
Speaker 2:They're gonna use the phrases and language that is used in real life right to get their point across like the like the v52.
Speaker 1:Like we just had d23 last week. Like the v52. Like this is the most expensive reshoots that we've ever had on this thing. Like we're like this is like phase 28. Like we're we're going through that stuff right now. Like we're gonna to be in phase seven in three years. They're not pulling this stuff out of thin air.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and that's the other part of it too. You're only mad at the political satire. You're not mad at the other satire Because you're faced with your own self-conscience, being forced to watch the political satire because you're being made fun of.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and you're realizing how ridiculous it is.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they're like this is over the top, no it isn't.
Speaker 1:They've always been this. This actually might if I'm being honest, this actually might have been more tamed. It's just the fact that this was happening in the real world that it feels like you don't think the stuff of like let's go to vault land and get a vault shake, like that's over exaggerated, like all those things are over exaggerating, like, like doing like a, like a pageant search, like this stuff is like happening, it's happening. It's just the fact that now it's in a political realm, of things that actually happen in the real world things that are actually said.
Speaker 2:Right, you know, I mean they, they throw out all those, all those key words and it's just, you know, it's just because it's coming from characters that you perceive as villainous. You think that it's too on the nose, but like you're the villain, like that maybe I, you know, hopefully that's that's what people are getting out of. This is like the reason the villainous characters are saying all the things that you're saying in your real life is because they're horrible things that you're saying you know what I mean like that's, that's, that's, that's what it comes down to. Like you're, you're, you're, you're the villain now flash like stormfront.
Speaker 1:Being a nazi, I guess isn't too bad to some people, but nazis down the street, that's fine. Yeah, it's cool. Stormfront, nazi bad and show nazi down street of my hometown good well, and that's where, that's where season four succeeds is.
Speaker 2:It takes the mask off of that and removes the delineation, like it removes the. It removes the, the word nazi, from the equation, and because I think, I think that that word is is so inflammatory that, like I would never be that because there's, like this is, there's this association with that that obviously carries a certain figure, it carries a certain figurehead, it carries a certain image of what you think that is. So you take that word out of it and you just keep the behavior of that. And that's when people get uncomfortable, because you're like wait exactly, like hold on a second, like you you took the word out of it, but like the behavior is still there. So now, now I'm uncomfortable because I I can't be that right, that is evil.
Speaker 1:And also, and I'll even go further not only is it like bad and evil, it's like, but this is my entertainment. Why is this bleeding into my? Why am I, why is my entertainment talking to me?
Speaker 2:because that's the only, because that's the only way you people learn. Anymore is unfortunately like the entertainment is more of the of the real world news delivery system than the actual news, because the news itself has become a parody and a satire.
Speaker 1:I'm going to. I'm actually going to use that star Wars point to the end of my life now, because what do you think? What do you think star Wars is, what do you think it is? You think it's just this nice little guy, luke Skywalker. That's such this shit. No, no, no, no, no. They are the freedom fighters that you so desperately hope never come to power. That's if anybody are ever to watch Andor and then be like, yeah, you know what the boys is. I'm like poof, you missed the whole show.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you missed the. And it's just because Andor is not using the terminology Like they're not. They're not overtly ripping from the headlines that like the boys is, but again, the boys is satireire, so it's supposed to do that. And you know, at the end of the day, like again, that just makes people uncomfortable. I think that's ultimately where it comes down to. They're not, they're not offended, they're just uncomfortable with the reality of of their belief system being a ridiculed and b being represented by a villainous faction. They just don't like that because they don't see themselves as the villains, right, but you know.
Speaker 1:Let's talk about Frenchie. No, I'm kidding. Let's talk about the nerdy stuff. Yeah, what's this season about?
Speaker 2:Butcher's dying. Yeah, Butcher's dying.
Speaker 1:Until, he's not Until he's not RIP Butcher.
Speaker 2:You're a real one.
Speaker 1:I know a crumpet hates to see you coming.
Speaker 2:Ryan coming to terms with his superheroism.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean let's approach this like House of the Dragon, let's go faction to faction. So let's talk about the boys first, let's talk about where the boys are. So the boys have one. And because and this is a big piece of why season three was so good, and it's the understanding of like, oh shoot, like newman is like, uh, she's a proper dangerous villain, like that's great job by that show for like making her like and not only just on like a power front, but also like on a political front of like my face is so marketable and I can go out to all these crowds and they'll cheer me on and love me, and also I can murder everybody in this room if I want to. Like she's equally as dangerous as Homelander is, like she truthfully is. So she I mean she probably had one of the best arcs of the show that you've had so far too. So, um, the boys themselves.
Speaker 2:So you go to Huey who we kind of talked about already talked.
Speaker 1:We already talked about, we already touched on Mother's Milk, MM.
Speaker 2:Having an identity and anxiety crisis?
Speaker 1:Yeah, you know who he's kind of playing as. He's kind of playing as Dig a little bit in Arrow. That's kind of how I think. Come on, man, not like that.
Speaker 2:Come on, man, what do you mean by that? Oh no, oh no, I thought it was going to be you. You know who he kind of reminds me of. He kind of reminds me of iron man 3 era tony stark, where he was just like I'm out, I'm out, I'm out. I can't handle this. I have too much trauma like I'm, I'm, I'm out, I'm out of this, I'm out of the game, I'm out of the game until I'm back in the game.
Speaker 1:Well, it's like, well, just physically, what his arc is is that he's now the leader of the boys. He's kind of he's he's in charge, you're large in his charge, um, and nobody's having it, nobody's following his orders. He's like he's trying to approach this like a commanding officer and he's he's again. It's I. I've said it for like three weeks in a row he's too noble, he just is. He's too noble. And butcher makes the. And you know what I like too, it's not even butcher that makes the point, it's mm himself that makes the point. He's like I can't do this, like I, they listen to you because you understand you.
Speaker 2:The tough call needs to be me you're willing to go places that I'm not willing to go, right and I can't and you can, so you need to lead it and but they also don't want butcher in charge yeah right, annie specifically hates butcher.
Speaker 1:They were arguing all season like an old married couple, much to huey's chagrin. That's my, that's my brother figure and my girlfriend figure. They don't like each other, no good.
Speaker 2:Um, so you have butcher dying, sucks dying and and being you know, he's got the, he's got the angel and the devil on his shoulder in the form of becca and, uh, whatever his name, kesler kesler there you go, his old mate comes back. Joe kesler, yeah the biggest, the biggest non-plot twist, plot twist in the history of television. Kessler's imaginary Right.
Speaker 1:What.
Speaker 2:He's what? And Butcher gets Venom powers yeah.
Speaker 1:That's it. No, truthfully, butcher's whole arc this season is it's Ryan. He's trying to save Ryan and he's trying to be good Like he's trying to be like all right, right, listen, man, don't be your dad, don't murder heaps of people. You can help somebody. Um, and then I want to touch on Ryan a little bit too, but it's how do you feel about the, about Butcher this season?
Speaker 2:Um, I think they are finally positioning him where he should have been, which is he's going to be a tertiary antagonist next season.
Speaker 1:He's not the good guy, he's never been the good guy, he's never been the good guy. And that's the point. And that's again why it was so important that Huey be the main character of the show, because once you get to Butcher, once you get to Homelander, you see, I'm truthfully powerless to people like this. They're two sides of the same coin, exactly. I'm truthfully powerless to people like this.
Speaker 2:They're two sides of the same coin. Exactly what I think season five is setting up that Butcher and Homelander are two sides of the same coin. Their ends justify their own personal means, but they don't justify the means to the ends of everyone else around them.
Speaker 1:Right, and that's what brings about Ryan. And that's the whole thing for Ryan, which I think is super interesting. And I'm glad we still don't know. And I'm glad we still don't know, and I think that's good we still don't know. Like that's a reveal. You can keep, keep it for a little bit, because then the shock factor of which way it goes is going to be. You know, it'd be so much easier for him to go with Butcher next season and be like you know what, I'm a good kid, I am a good kid, raised me right. It would be infinitely more interesting if he's like nope, I'm, I am my dad, like I am gonna, I am gonna hold the stranglehold over the and then butcher's gonna be forced to make a decision, which is probably gonna be to kill ryan next season or ryan's gonna be the one that makes the decision, whether you know, I don't, I don't I think they might be positioning him to be in position where his, where his decision isn't a binary one.
Speaker 2:You know where he's not taking. You know he's not either taking the path to light or the path of darkness. He's gonna end up taking the path to the twilight he's gonna take just sort of like a bipartisan character. He's gonna himself he's gonna take the path of the in-between where, like you know, he's gonna eventually see butcher for the monster that he's become.
Speaker 2:And you know you have to wonder what that's gonna do to him right like he's been kind of learning this entire time, like the kind of monster that Homelander is, but like what happens when he finds out that Butcher has also become the monster.
Speaker 1:Yeah, not only like. Emotionally and mentally, physically he's become a monster, and that's the whole point. He is Venom now. We are Venom, we are Butcher.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they gave him venom venom powers, which makes sense, yeah I'm I'm actually cool with.
Speaker 1:I know some people weren't happy.
Speaker 2:I was like that it makes it makes more sense than giving him homelander powers exactly because it would be too easy.
Speaker 1:It'd be way too easy just to do that and we already did it. This is like a different way and I I love the parasitic nature of it too, like I think that's very interesting, which would have made it better if huey was still the main character, because because that's what Huey was to him for a lot. Huey was the one, just like his brother Lenny, that was kind of prodded with him the whole time and patted on the back and bought with him the whole time. Take your little brother with you.
Speaker 2:Aw yeah.
Speaker 1:I don't want to. Who else?
Speaker 2:we got Frenchie and Kimiko. Frenchie and Kimiko Again, we talked about this in episode three. I was like hoping that this subplot ended up going somewhere, and then it did, kinda, but it wasn't the most compelling thing. Yeah, it just. It got compelling at the end, when he gets abducted and she screams for him like that. That's, that was an impactful moment, for sure.
Speaker 1:Oh, this show's finale was one of the best finales of that was a really great episode.
Speaker 2:The finale of television.
Speaker 1:This was probably one of the better finales that I've seen um, but yeah, I mean, it's just such a non-starter as well, because we already know that frenchie has a breaded his ledger. We already know this. Like we right, this is we. Yeah, there's no new ground being treaded for him yeah like he's murdered.
Speaker 1:And you oh, I remember I texted you. I was like you know why I love season one. Season one, one's raw Season one, has like it's got this raw edge to season one and it was when Frenchie was telling Huey about the first time he had like done a contract kill and he talks about like a woman walks into the elevator and like you know he was describing her and he's like, and he's like what happened to Colin, stuff. It's like again. It's like the desensit, like I'm desensitized, I'm like I know he's a POS, like I already like I know he's done really crappy things, and we know this.
Speaker 2:this, this extra-aneous character, Colin, is not gonna become a main player.
Speaker 1:So if they would've made this was a little bit more of like a charged sense of like they were a judge on the homelander trial or something like that, then it would have been like, oh okay, this is actually something now. But like, again, nothing's new, like, okay, like you're doing this to put a little contention in between Kemiko and Frenchie, but they've always had that, they've always had the will. They won't. They just pick one. You can pick one and be on with it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you don't need to drive more tension, ratchet up more tension in that relationship.
Speaker 1:Because it's not the fact of the will they won't they. It's just the fact that they're with each other. They're always with each other.
Speaker 2:So her, each other, so like her scream at the end always would have resonated that way. It would have always been. I always would have felt something.
Speaker 1:Yes, even if you did this after season one.
Speaker 2:I 100 something, yep, 100 um and then starlight, obviously, yeah, one of the biggest pieces to this. She gets the spider man 2 problem. It's what happens to her. And then she, she gets her groove back at the end of the season.
Speaker 1:Wolverine's over 40 all the time.
Speaker 2:It's okay she flies now. She flies now um I out of all of them I think I liked her art, the most. She has the most dynamic arc and the most compelling one out of everybody especially like when she has her action items, and I really resonated with, like when she, when she pummels firecracker, I'm like hell, yeah, yeah, good, like I was. I was really happy with that when she, when she fights the deep, like that was really good too like let your hands go, it's fine.
Speaker 1:Like it's beast are light. She, you know what it is. It's like the lucy mclean from fallout thing. Like you're in this now. Like you're not this good, wholesome person. Like, and you don't have to be this good, you're still a good person, but that doesn't mean you have to be a nice person. Like, yeah, you're allowed to let your head. Like, look at what they've done to you over how many years. Look at what they've done to you. Yep, beat the living daylights out of them and everybody will be fine with it too.
Speaker 1:Like I said, the only piece and this isn't really like arc, like an arcing piece, it's just a little character bit which is just super frustrating. It's like after you, after you know the big piece and you know there's a shapeshifter. So obviously we're going to talk about sister sage in a little bit. Who is? We don't know what. She is still right. Maybe she's too smart for us too, because I still don't know what she is.
Speaker 1:I think this is a game there, though I think this is all like one big giant, like game of monopoly that she's playing, that she's like that's how, like cynical and sociopathic she is. She's like I don't really care what happens, I don't care if, even if I die, I'm just having a bit of fun and like look of what one genius is a little bit of fun can do to the entire world, like actually destabilize the entire world. But for for starlight, like it's just that bit where, like the shapeshifter obviously ship, ships into annie. Um, her and huey, you know, are together. And then annie's like how dare you? Like no, no, huey was just assaulted, but it's fine. I just how did you not know it was me?
Speaker 2:it's like because you guys look exactly the same, because that's the power set that and then he, he did figure it out and he does explain to her, like you know how I knew, and then he does this, you know, like you kind of said, it is kind of like sitcom-y where he brings up all the benign things about her that only he would know, you know. So it's kind of like a cutesy, like aww, but you didn't need it. Their relationship is so rock solid that, like you didn't, I don't, I'm not watching the boys for the, for the annie huey tension right, not anymore, like I, we already.
Speaker 1:We've already done that, we've already been through that. Yeah, we're getting to the end here, like we only have one season left.
Speaker 2:I don't let them be together.
Speaker 1:Let them be strong together because then if one of them dies which I thought one of them, I thought annie was going to die, this like if one of them ends up, then it's going to hurt so much more. Again, it's the whole Kimiko and Frenchie thing. You take Frenchie away. I still would have felt the same way after season one and two that I had felt after right now. I didn't need anything from the last two to three seasons from this.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and then, before we get to the seven, I guess we can talk about Newman. She finally gets hers, she gets her comeuppance. She gets ripped in half Right After doing, after appearing to to. She was going to side with the good guys, yeah, and Butcher was like nah, absolutely not.
Speaker 1:All right. So the big piece for Newman is Robert Singer. Shout out Supernatural, robert Singer is the president. He's just Shout out Supernatural, robert Singer is the president. It's election time, this whole season is around, the election, and then Robert Singer wins. He wins and the whole plot and plan is that we're going to overthrow the government on January 6th. We're going to overthrow the government. Wait, is this play about us?
Speaker 2:That's the president of the government you're talking about.
Speaker 1:If you're not trying to reference fallout, you shouldn't be referencing.
Speaker 2:It feels great um, and then singer is retroactively also trying to get maiman killed because he knows that well.
Speaker 1:He's working with the cia, he's, he's with, he's with mm and he's like the cia assassinating a political person?
Speaker 2:what?
Speaker 1:they would never do anything like that. Martin luther king jr. They would never do anything like that. Why would they? Why would they ever do that? Malcolm x, why would they ever think about doing anything like that? Anyway, I probably shouldn't have said that on here. It's fine, you said they wouldn't do it. Oh right, right, because they wouldn't right. They would never do something.
Speaker 2:So yeah, that you know. And so Singer understands that he's operating on a ticking time clock, that as soon as he wins, newman's probably going to try and kill him, Right, and that's exactly what they are trying to do.
Speaker 1:She's properly menacing this season. She is properly like ooh, the best thing that they do is it's the thanos thing. Within the first five minutes of the first episode, yeah, they put a gun to her head, bullet ricochets right off her head because we didn't know that before, we didn't know that she was invulnerable before, and then huey throws acid in her face just like you ruined my god dang suit and I gotta go on. In five minutes we just won georgia, I gotta go on. And you're like, and like the viewer's like, oh, shoot, like she can't die. The question mark. I thought she, I thought she can die, yeah, and turns out she can die. I have questions about that, but I'll save it.
Speaker 1:I guess for once we get down there um but yeah, so I I love that heart to heart that she has with huey as well too. Or he was just like why'd you lie? Like why'd you? And that's a big piece for a character like why are you lying about who you are?
Speaker 2:Homelander confronts her on it too.
Speaker 1:Like why are you running away? It's like I know why you're running away. It's because you know that Daddy Edgar has all the power and she spits it right back in your face. It's like who are you talking to me about him having all the power Back up my man.
Speaker 2:I mean and that really goes back to the core difference between Huey and Homelander is like Homelander doesn't give Newman a choice because he's unhinged and eventually he's just like you're just tell the world that you're a soup, and then he does it in front of everyone, right, and that's what makes Newman. It doesn't make Newman realize that Homelander is unhinged, but it's like it's the final nail in the coffin of like we all right, homelander actually is more dangerous than I thought correct because he just doesn't care anymore, right, like he doesn't care about his public perception anymore. Yep um.
Speaker 1:Who else do we got? We already talked ryan.
Speaker 2:We talked newman um guess we just go to the seven yeah, yeah, let's go to the seven.
Speaker 1:Let's start at the bottom of the seven, which is the deepest part, the deep the deep.
Speaker 2:I guess we could just do deep and Noir, because they were like a buddy.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they were like a buddy cop duo.
Speaker 2:Buddy cop duo New Noir, who's also old Noir which is pretty fun.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's the actor that played Noir.
Speaker 2:Finally got some stuff to do.
Speaker 1:Right, once a Godalkin.
Speaker 2:He was hilarious.
Speaker 1:Yeah, he was fun.
Speaker 2:He was very funny. Narcoleptic Can fly.
Speaker 1:He flies the actual art actor, apparently also an narcoleptic. Yeah, yeah, they said he would. I think there's videos of him falling asleep on set and they'll roll up to him and be like dude, that's fantastic I think that's great.
Speaker 2:Um, I mean they, they, they are relegated to I mean, the deep was always relegated to this, but both of them are relegated to like goofy henchmen one and two role essentially. Now, like neither of them are, like inherently dangerous, noir's dangerous yeah, the deep's not not dangerous? I don't think he's still, as he's as dangerous as like any other soup, right, he's just a bumbling idiot still so it's and I did like.
Speaker 2:I did like the kind of like when they're doing that fight in the in the office, like I do, like that they kind of relegated back to like the season one mindset of like we don't know how to kill him. Like remember, like season one they had like had to have like exact plans on how to like kill, all of them like translucent, like you needed a specific way to kill him, like I you almost again like to the disease sensation point. Like you kind of forget that, like no, you kind of got to come at all these guys a unique way, right, like you can't just I mean, maybe not now butchered, being able to do what he can do I still have questions, but but like I did kind of like that where, like they get the deep, like down and they're like do you know how to kill him?
Speaker 2:because I sure don't. Yeah, like, and noir can fly, so he's gonna be back soon he's invulnerable on top of that too. So I did kind of like that, they kind of brought that back. But, like I said, those two characters are kind of like that. They kind of brought that back. But, like I said, those two characters are kind of relegated to Henchmen 1 and 2. Right, they're like the muscle, bebop and Rocksteady.
Speaker 1:Exactly, exactly. Who are the new members of the Seven? We'll save Sage for very, very last Firecracker, firecracker.
Speaker 2:She's Alex Jones with breasts.
Speaker 1:That's pretty much that's going to do it for another episode.
Speaker 2:That's pretty much what's going on there. Um and so yep, they find her at like a conspiracy convention. She's like a podcaster, podcast radio host Right Um, and yeah, she's a horrible human.
Speaker 1:Yeah, she sucks, but but she's got hands, she does a little bit a little bit a little bit, not as money, not as much hands.
Speaker 2:Yeah, she gets thrown around quite a bit but don't totally know what she's. Just, she can just punch. Well, she's got the yeah it's like the firecracker.
Speaker 1:Oh, she's got jubilee powers yeah right, exactly right, she's. I forgot, she has jubilee firecracker from the boys comics robert, she's actually not, because she's an original character yeah, she had.
Speaker 2:Uh, yeah, she's got jubilee powers, right um who else? We got but she also has that you know, she has the self-awareness to be like I don't. I mean, I believe some of what I said. That's what I wanted to get to.
Speaker 1:I wanted to talk about like they cool, she's like a, she's like a really bad person that's just spewing nonsense, because that doesn't happen.
Speaker 2:But they gave her a little bit of a backstory they did give her a little bit of backstory, which I was surprised by and it was pretty dang good and I was like, wait, I kind of feel bad for her a little bit, like she got hilariously mistreated by by young starlight.
Speaker 1:Yeah yeah, and that's the, and it was a great piece to add on the starlet story, like again to the, to inform this universe like nobody's inherently good or bad and it also informs firecracker a little bit, when starla was like I'm you know, I I change, I'm a changed person.
Speaker 2:And firecracker's like no, no, you're not people don't change, right, and I'm like, oh yeah, kind of like informs, like her worldview, right of like how she feels, even if she, even if she felt like she could change, she knows she feels that her heart she couldn't like, even if, like, she got to the point where, like you know, maybe I am a shitty person, like she'll always believe she's a shitty person. It's like there's a little bit of like intrinsic, you know, stuff there that I like. I also like that homelander is like just turned off by her besides the one thing that it's how done he is with everybody it's the best, best, and I mean we'll get to him.
Speaker 1:I mean, let's just go right to Sage then, because that's the piece of where Homelander is. Like you need something. So Sister Sage, crazy name Sage, living in Detroit, she was on Teenage Kicks with A-Train. Oh, we didn't even talk about A-Train.
Speaker 2:We'll talk to him. We'll talk to him, we'll talk about.
Speaker 1:A-Train. We'll talk to A-Train. We're going to knock the actor.
Speaker 2:We're going to talk to A-Train, we'll talk about A-Train. I think he gets a little bit more. Obviously, he has a little bit more to do. But Sage, yeah, sage, sage is. You know, she's the genius. They finally got a super genius on the show.
Speaker 1:The world's World's smartest person alive.
Speaker 2:Sister Sage. Yeah, what's Baron Mordo doing here? Wait, your first name is Carl. Yeah, so, homelander, to your point, is done with all the yes men. We need people in the seven. We need better people in the seven, people that are going to speak up to me and not be so afraid of me. So he finds sister sage and she's just like, yeah, like to your point, like she kind of just gets the wheel spinning in his head a little bit about like what if you were the president? Like what if you were in charge? What's?
Speaker 1:happening is they're going through, they're trying to round back out the seven, because still corporate america, so they're trying to round out the seven. They go through the entire list, whole bunch of easter eggs in there and then he sees this like world's smartest person, like atrian's like nah, she's a jerk, like she's annoying, doesn't matter, and homeowner's like huh, I'm gonna go put on some civilian clothes. The first time we've ever seen him. Yeah, I didn't like it. Yeah, it was weird. He's been naked or in the suit, so this has been the weirdest thing I didn't has been the weirdest thing.
Speaker 2:I didn't like him in civilian clothes. It was unsettling.
Speaker 1:He's like an anti-Clark Kent.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it talked me the wrong way. Yeah, I didn't like it.
Speaker 1:Oh Anyway. So he goes to her apartment. She's got books for days. She's eating Taco Bell Good time, mm-hmm, good time. Homelander's just like hey, I heard you were kind of smart. And she's just like yeah, I know you're getting older, I know that your prostate isn't working the same. I know what you want. And he's just like how do you know any of those things? She's like didn't you read the tagline of my character? I'm the world's smartest person. So he essentially says what would you do? And she's just like it. People that follow you. That's how we can truthfully get this done, yeah.
Speaker 1:And you're almost like they're talking about the real world anyway, and it's also.
Speaker 2:It's also like the point of like you're going about this world domination thing, all wrong. Like you're, you're God, essentially Like, just be God, right, she's like. She's like you're overcomplicating the situation.
Speaker 1:Like you again. This is and we're going to talk about homelander in one second. But she homelander asked his own personal question is like what do I want? Like and this is what season three did, really like he got everything. He got everything he wanted. He did he got everything he wanted. Like soldier boys out of the picture.
Speaker 2:Well, just wait, um, yeah and then. But yeah, like sage, and then I do. I do enjoy that. The through line of like all these characters feel like they kind of gotta, they kind of have an angle on him, and then they realize how unhinged he is and even sage is like oh shit like I like even sage was like I don't.
Speaker 1:This is kind of crazy you say you, you said that I don't think I I might be the only person. I think she's playing along.
Speaker 2:I think she's equated for any and every last thing, that what he can do you would hope so, but also, like the problem with writing geniuses is your own, like the genius can only be as smart as the writers. So, like you don't actually know how, like the depths of her intent in, uh, intellectualism until the show finishes and we see what happens. So I mean, I guess they could always write to that point if they chose to like no, she actually knew what was going on the entire time, which, like to your cryptic point, yeah how many times can you actually get away with that, right?
Speaker 2:if you're, you're not Yoshi Torunaga, right, because that?
Speaker 1:guy knew everything. He did know everything, and those writers were geniuses. But I believed it.
Speaker 2:I believed that he knew everything, why would I tell a dead?
Speaker 1:man, my plan. Hmm, we're going to talk about Shogun actually now.
Speaker 2:We did yeah. We're going to do another four-hour Shogun episode to this um, a train, um, finally got his redemption. A rc baby, that's an arc. That's an arc, right there. He finally got one. He finally, it finally happened.
Speaker 1:We finally, we, we, jamie lannister and a train yeah, that's the best comparison you could have made. It's somebody that was so far gone and like a definitive. This is no. No, this is one of the villains of the show. Like this, guy is no good, he's no good. Rotten, dirty, stinking a train maybe, not maybe not.
Speaker 2:He was redeemed so well that everyone was sure he was gonna die in the finale.
Speaker 1:I was going on tiktok and I saw every a train editor. Like my boys. I was like you remember when a trade murdered robin, right, like are we, did we forget? And he killed what's her name? Uh, pop claw. Yeah, killed, killed heaps of people, got his brother crippled, right Like A-Train's not a good guy, but that's the point. He's like I don't need to be a like good, isn't a?
Speaker 2:good. I might not be a good guy, but I'm not the worst guy.
Speaker 1:Homelander's the worst guy Like I, even to the point like, oh man, that scene with the kid where he's like, and then he follows it up the next episode. He's like I. I when I say when I saved you last week, I saved you in last week.
Speaker 2:I became a real. I became a real hero. He said.
Speaker 1:That kid looked at me like I was a superhero, like anything that I've ever done for vought in the last. How many years has all been fabricated? Well, not like I haven't felt an ink, like all the screaming fans have never even come remotely close to that kid's look in that eye when I saved you and like just the, the, the culmination of like the thing between him and huey, and he was like I'm sorry, huey, like and it came to a head in season three too, and he said like stop acting like we're so much different, Like we aren't too too much different, Like you made a mistake.
Speaker 1:I made a mistake. At least I owned up to my mistake.
Speaker 2:And then they clasp their hands and flex their biceps together and then we get the really cool, like the full turn when he fights the deep Right, you know something deep I always hated joe, same bro. And then he puts them, put them hand. He puts the hands on the deep and that's the moment, like you're like, wait, I'm rooting, why am I rooting for a train? You're like, oh, shoot, I'm wrapped up in it. Like I feel like he got. I feel like he got the most satisfying arc of the entire season to be perfectly honest.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's just, and it's like again, again. It's one of the things we always talk about, like sometimes simple is better. This isn't an overcomplicated thing.
Speaker 2:It's a redemption arc, it's a classic redemption arc, but when I feel like this is just like a personal preference, like the redemption arc, when it's done well, is the best kind of character arc trope that you can get, it's so easy to like revenge arc.
Speaker 1:Like revenge arc is easy in the sense of like we can like somebody killed somebody. Somebody should get their Abby from the Last of Us. If somebody kills somebody, like somebody should get the, you know, should get their lick back. That's fine.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:For this, a redemption arc to your point why it's so satisfying, it's because, like you know, you have to pull a character out from the holes of villainy, right.
Speaker 1:And it's like even further with that like sometimes life is difficult to do the right things. A lot of times, especially in A-Train, she was like A-Train was this corporate shill for how long, like, and he was blinded Like. He was like there's no good to be done and he probably learned early. He probably learned early. He probably was like Annie at one point. He was like I'm going to be a hero and then he got there like oh, there's no such thing as a hero.
Speaker 2:And what makes what they did with him this season so remarkable? Is they flirted with it so much throughout the other seasons, like is this going to be the thing that puts him onto the side of good, and then he pulls back, yeah.
Speaker 1:And then season three, he actually flips it. He actually goes further back into the, into the, into being a bad guy.
Speaker 2:And you're like oh, like he's cooked, Like he's never gonna right, he's never going to snap out of this until he does.
Speaker 1:You know how they first when he kills blue hawk.
Speaker 2:Like he did it for himself, first to realize I can do this for other people too. Like he, and it's also a realization. Like him, killing blue hawk is the viewer's realization that, like he's not a great guy but he still has some type of morality.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and like there's always gonna be worse guys than like there's. Look at blue hawk himself. Exactly yeah, blue hawk is like, like you know, care bears compared to homel is like, like you know, care Bears compared to Homelander. Like yeah like there's nothing as bad, like I'm I'm not a good person, but like I can do good things and that was the piece of like that. Look in that kid's eyes. Like I'll. I'll never get something like that from whatever Vaught would do.
Speaker 2:He will unfortunately be cooked next season though he's getting violently murdered. He might even get killed by butcher, which would be so interesting because, butcher, could you know, wheel around like no, when I said, like all of them, like a train's not redeemable, like I don't care what, I don't care what he did for mn obviously the what it's going to come to ahead to is probably later down the season.
Speaker 1:In season five it's going to come down to annie. He's going to probably try to kill annie and he's like well, what are you doing? Like he's like no, no, I'm killing every single last one, I don't care if it's her yeah, he's got.
Speaker 2:I mean, he's got his mentality back. Yeah, like he's, he got cured by the parasite and now he's got that season one mentality back about like now they all gotta go, like besides ryan, right, like they all gotta go. And that's the point. So your point about like now they all gotta go, like besides ryan, right, like they all gotta go.
Speaker 1:And that's the point. So your point about like why they're the same side of the different side of the same coin, like homelander doesn't care if every single human was gone off the planet, he would actually probably prefer it that way, like besides ryan and besides ryan, and that's the whole point, for ryan being the first natural born, so he's the best of both worlds. He physically came from both factions of that side.
Speaker 2:Yeah, speaking of Homelander, I guess, we'll just wrap it up. We'll wrap it up here, run him his Emmy.
Speaker 1:Yeah, let's just talk about Anthony Starr for a little bit. I mean, he is one of the most important television characters probably ever. He's going to be one of the most recognizable, one of the best performances out of an actor in television that you will ever find. There's no if and or but. You know how I know it's good. That's not Anthony Starr, that's just Homelander. That's just his best friend, Metro Booming, but it's just Homelander.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, 100%. I mean episode four, when it's like a Homelander, it's essentially a homeland, it's essentially a homeland. Or bottle episode um, where he goes back to the red room and it's not the red room, but you know what I mean. Um and he and and you're again, you're in this position where you're like I kind of get it like I kind of get why he did what he did, like and I'm just like they tortured him and, you know, pushed into like they're also bad people even though they're humans like I. Just it's funny, like I find myself like when he's, when he's at work dealing with his co-workers, and I'm like I kind of get it. I kind of get like why he's so frustrated like he did. He's finally I don't I wouldn't say finally, because I think he always knew Like, I think truly like the only person he felt he could rely on in the Seven was Maeve.
Speaker 1:Mm-hmm, Because Maeve is like I see you for who you are, and Homelander's like I also see you for who you are and you're like you're not. You're not incompetent Like you around right you're pretty and it's not even like a power thing, it's just like you're not an idiot.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like I'm so now he's surrounded by idiots right, and then he brings firecracker on and he thought that was gonna be nice. And then he's like, oh, you're just another one of these. Like you're probably the worst version of this too, yeah, but you have you know right so I'm willing to let that slide. But any other time she's not doing that with him, he's repulsed by her right. Remember when he, when she coughs yeah, he's like.
Speaker 2:Oh my god, he's like go sit over there, yeah, and then she goes like one chair down. He's like further, further, perfect, um, uh, yeah, I mean he's pretty much out on all of them, except for sage, right at this point all right.
Speaker 1:What's the plan?
Speaker 2:what's sage's plan conquer the world, conquer the world, world domination. The same thing, and it is every night binky boy Conquer the world, conquer the world, world domination. The same thing as every night.
Speaker 1:Binky boy Right, take over the world. So here's my thing for Sage's plan. Why it's great? Because she again she's just having a laugh. I think they're going to reveal that in season five.
Speaker 1:She's like, I think, and she kind of touched on it at the end of season four she walks out at the end of season four. Like she walks out. She's not even in her suit, she's just in like that turtleneck and jack. She's just like. I just wanted to see if I can do it. This is fun. Yeah, and again, that's the whole piece for the genius character, which makes a lot of sense and makes it more humanized. It's like I just wanted to see if I can do it. Like and that's the true fear of the genius character is like the indifference, like it's kind of like getting into like Hickman's Reed Richards, where it's like and we always joke about it like bad dad Reed Richards, like Reed Richards at the end of the day is like he's a family man but like his mind sometimes outraces, like the logic, like his logical mind outraces the emotional feeling of having a family.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean it's Tony, so it's also the Ultron thing, like just. I just wanted to see if I could do it Right.
Speaker 1:Like I'm not. I'm not indifferent to anybody. Like if somebody kills somebody, if one race ends another race. She's like I just wanted to see if I can have fun. And like it makes sense because, like her motivation is, like you know, being the smartest woman. It doesn't. Or smartest person in life doesn't matter. Like I cured cancer and the doctors said good job, little girl. Now you're gonna watch your grandmother die when she didn't have to. She's like I want to see if I can pull this one off and see if people will actually listen. Like you've got the most powerful man on the planet dead to rights. And this is to your point about homelander. Like the thing she wasn't equating for, and again, for the genius character she wasn't. She's equating for everything. Logically, she's not equating for emotion and homelander. Unfortunately, after episode four, he's gone. This is the break we were waiting for. Yeah, three for emotion and Homelander. Unfortunately, after episode 4, he's gone.
Speaker 2:This is the break we were waiting for for 3 and a half, for 3 and a half seasons you thought it was going to be the rally killing when he realizes that he can get away with literal murder.
Speaker 1:But still, there was a little piece of like and he goes back to the corporate sense. Like he can walk around that tower and murder every single person if he wanted to, but it's the programming that they put into his head. He's like edgar talks about it and then the the doctors confirm it in episode four. Like we, we broke your brain essentially and we program, we rewired your brain to be obedient so you don't murder everybody on the planet and now he just doesn't care yeah, now, and he needed to murder everybody there to get there and it goes back to like what he said.
Speaker 2:He has the the back and forth with starlight in season two, I think, where he's like when she's gonna release the tape. What he said on the plane. He said go ahead, and if I, if you do like, I'm gonna tear this whole motherfucker down, yeah, like I'm like let's start with the critical infrastructure.
Speaker 1:Like I will, I will fly through new york and physically destroy every building, every, every corner of new york if I have to. I'll murder everybody on this planet if I, okay. And who's going to stop me? Right, there's not one person that can.
Speaker 1:And what's great piece about Newman is you're like it's funny for Newman because like, obviously, logically in your brain, you're like that's the villain, right. But then also you're like, oh, I hope she kind of is there to kill Homelander, think she tries it. So we get later in the season, um, you find out basically that you know she, he outs it to the world, he lasers her. I think she tries it, I think she tries to pop his head on tv and I think she's like, oh, shoot, like I can't. And then to the point um, for butcher it's like butcher, then killing newman kind of sets up, like maybe he can do it, maybe, maybe because we find out newman's invulnerable, homelander's obviously invulnerable newman tries to kill homelander. It doesn't work. Now the homelander or butcher kills newman. Now you're like, oh wait, like maybe he's the only one that can do this and there's one other.
Speaker 2:There's one other player exactly, and it's the well, I mean ryan, I guess is another player in play but I thought it was.
Speaker 1:it was Frenchie, just kidding, I thought it was.
Speaker 2:Colin, the post-finale stinger, is that Homelander finds Soldier Boy Mm-hmm. And they've already, I believe, said that Soldier Boy is going to be set up as an antagonist in Season 5. Right, but to who?
Speaker 1:Right To who is he the antagonist for?
Speaker 2:And we don't know, obviously, because he's been on literal ice this entire season. We don't know what he remembers, we don't know where he's at, we don't know what his mindset is, whether or not Homelander assuming Homelander is going to be the one to wake him up.
Speaker 1:I think Homelander's going to try to spin it too as a family affair. So when he wakes him, upander's going to try to spin it too as like a family affair. So like when he wakes him up it's going to be like Soldier Boy Homelander and Homeboy all together.
Speaker 1:What a crazy name the three of them all together as like a family, and Butcher's going to be like I'm murdering all three of them if I have to and that's going to be Butcher's thing. It's like he's going to do the in his mind is going to be like you said all of them, Said all of them. So here's all of them and we're going to get informed a lot from Gen V, season two as well.
Speaker 2:Like that's probably going to be a big and not, as the season didn't tie as much into Gen V as we might have thought it did, it was just the virus, the virus, the Homelander going to save Ashley. In the first episode she's like thanks, homelander.
Speaker 1:And then Kate and Sam show up for a bit. Somehow, kate and Sam returned.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they're like the seven sleeper agents. Essentially they're not actually in the seven, but they're like seven adjacent.
Speaker 1:They're next up. They're probably going to insert both of them into the seven. But I also imagine that that's, or like one like Team USA puts one college player on the team.
Speaker 2:That's exactly what they are, but they might. That whole thing might get resolved in Gen V season two Sure sure. Because assume like the rest of that crew has to break out of wherever they are and probably confront Sam and Kate and maybe bring them back on like their side.
Speaker 1:Well, that's what I think. So I think there's going to be three planned fronts. There's going to be three planned fronts, there's going to be homeowner's plan and we're we're probably going to get to a head like the January 6th. Well, singer has been arrested, so yeah, Um, what's his name? Is the president? Whoever the? I forget if he was the attorney general, whoever the guy was from season one that came back for this season.
Speaker 2:Who's the secretary of state? Yeah?
Speaker 1:Who is essentially just Mike Pence, right, that's how I read him, Kind of yeah, so because he does what Mike Pence did, he's like nobody's going to not tell me that the election is certified. So, with Homelander standing right behind him, they're probably going to get to the front where Homelander's like no, we're going to do this we're basically turning America into a soup state like a police soup state.
Speaker 1:Yeah them, he deputizes all the, all the so they they pull off martial law and then also the most dangerous team against them. The boys is broken like they. They break the boys like huey gets taken by kate, by whatever her name is, the um, I forget what her name is cindy. Cindy from season two, yeah, that we hadn't seen in so long that people were like we need her back. She's back and she's more dangerous than ever. Um, obviously, frenchie gets taken by kate. Um, I don't know what, what I think, you know what.
Speaker 2:I think she probably, they're probably gonna make frenchie find out how to kill all the soups that oppose them you know, yeah, and I do feel like kate's gonna like, potentially, like winter, soldierize Frenchie a little bit Mm-hmm and, like you know, brainwash him into being like their soup killer Mm-hmm, right, I think that could happen. Yep, like Frenchie should, like a masked man, shows up to try and like, kill Kimiko and she rips his mask off, and it's Frenchie, right what about colin right, um, who else do we got?
Speaker 1:uh, and then mm is he goes with. I forget what he does at the end. Uh, oh, no, love sausage got him. No, yeah, yeah, oh yeah, the only.
Speaker 2:The only members of the boys that are free right now are starlight and butcher yeah, yeah, and butcher and chemical right, and I know chemical that's again, it goes uh sam from gen v.
Speaker 1:Don't know, kimiko got taken. Sam from gen v takes like, it's like, you're sam from gen v, yeah, you're sam from gen v, and it's like, and it's. It's such a good comp for her too, because, like she's like, oh, surely kimiko can demolish anybody.
Speaker 2:And I'm like, oh wait, probably not sam, though, because sam's a yeah, sam's a five foot eight juggernaut right, the world's tiniest juggernaut you better keep your mouth shut.
Speaker 1:She doesn't like to chatter. What? What juggernaut are you? What is? This um, so yeah, it's just why were you from, like boston, that juggernaut from tenfold? Where are you from?
Speaker 2:um, yeah, so butcher and starlight are the only members of the boys that are currently free, and is he?
Speaker 1:even a member of the boys anymore.
Speaker 2:No.
Speaker 1:It's just her and she's a suit. Boys are cooked.
Speaker 2:But I imagine, I think Starlight is eventually going to link up with the Gen V crew.
Speaker 1:Well, yeah, she's probably going to try to. Well, what her whole thing is going to be. She's going to it's going to be a civil war. She's going to try to get her own team together. I'm putting a team together, the boys.
Speaker 2:The girls, the girls. Yeah, we'll see. I mean they. They definitely later found this is going to be the final season, so they're obviously. Everything has to come to a conclusion, right? Um?
Speaker 1:I'm expecting full out anarchy this season, like full out, like anything that they were reserving for, like the.
Speaker 1:It's funny that I listened to the the script apart podcast with the one of the writers for fallout and they were talking about why are we so obsessed with the end of the world scenario, like that's something like in media, that like we keep seeing and like people love it, like they love the end of the world thing to keep happening and happening. Yeah, so like I think this season five is going to be that this is going to be like the police state, like absolute anarchy going off, like martial law, like nothing is good type of season. Yeah, I just hope it's funny enough that I'm thinking about it this way. I just hope it's funny enough that I'm thinking about it this way. It's my Anthony Mackie thing for Captain America 4. Don't forget who the main character of the show is. It's Huey, not necessarily the main character, but who the point of view character is. Don't forget that Jack Quaid still needs to be the most, probably the most important person in there to keep everything glued together and keep Butcher together.
Speaker 2:That was one of his biggest points yeah, yeah, 100 and then, um, you know, like I said, we're gonna see what gen v season two, how that ties in. I assume it will tie in a little more substantially than than this season the first season did to the second, uh, to this season of the boys, um, and we know that jared pedealecki is apparently coming, um, I've seen some theories thrown around that he might be an aged up ryan that would be kind of interesting.
Speaker 1:I don't know how much I'd like that, because I'm not a big fan of when shows and movies do that where they or sometimes it all depends on how you package it house of the dragon, right, right, like where you throw it forward to the that's. But that has stipulation, because there was a show that already had been made but how much is he gonna?
Speaker 2:how much is he gonna age that he turns into 40 year old jared padalecki? Well, that's my point of like.
Speaker 1:I don't like necessarily love when, when shows do that, when they're like, let's throw it forward and like. But how did we get here and like this little weird? So how did we get?
Speaker 2:here I think you just end up.
Speaker 1:He just ends up as as some type of one-off scene with soldier boy right maybe or he's or they do the mr marathon thing where he's just in the show to say that we completed the supernatural boys crossover yeah, so they're just. They'll give him a scene with with jensen and probably like I said he's probably going to be mr marathon, like the speedster that came before a train and like they were probably in the seven together at the same time.
Speaker 2:Put him in the Jensen spinoff.
Speaker 1:Sure, I think that would actually be a good idea. Let the two of them cook together. Put Jeffrey Dean Morgan. Find a way to put Kessler in there too. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:So, but I think that's really all we know about season five is Jerry padalecki will probably be in it and that soldier boy is, you know, positioned to be an antagonist yeah, and I'm, and obviously I'm not naive, so I'm assuming anthony star is gonna have one of the single best performances in television history next year.
Speaker 1:Like I, he's probably gonna be properly one of the most, just the most important villains we've ever seen on television and it'll be like it'll be properly like solidified next year of like he is, he is modern, he is modern villainy yeah yeah, I've never seen such a wretched hive of scum and villainy.
Speaker 2:Um and that's it. That's it was season four. Um, the girls is hilarious. All in all, um, you know, I, I think, I think I enjoyed the overarchingness for the most point, if not some of our main characters didn't really get a ton to do, but I thoroughly enjoyed the A-Train Redemption arc.
Speaker 1:This season is still good. Yeah, it's still good this season is still very good.
Speaker 2:Thoroughly enjoyed the A-Train Redemption arc, really enjoyed Starlight's arc for the most part. Um, homelander's characterization continues to be effortlessly fantastic, um, and I think we we set butcher up to be in a position where he might also be a villain, so, um, that's also very interesting.
Speaker 1:It's just, like to your point, just a little disappointed in the in the huey arc this season I think he, I think his character got kind of shuffled aside, um, which is unfortunate because, like you said, he's the point of view character so he should be yeah, a little more elevated to your point about like satirical places of operating storytelling wise, like a character like huey is very important for that because, like for satire, you kind of need somebody with you to kind of usher you along of like, no, it's fine that this is like this is like, this isn't absurd, like this isn't an absurd piece.
Speaker 1:So, um, that's the only thing. That's the only thing that I that I'm kind of griped with this season. Um, this show is woke Cause. Woke doesn't exist.
Speaker 2:Yeah and yeah. I mean we'll see. We'll see what next season holds. I mean we talk all the time Like finales are hard.
Speaker 1:Yeah, this one might be one of the in terms of, like overall television finales all the time. This might be one of the tougher ones to pull off. This might be one of the most difficult ones that they have to stick the landing on, because of how much traction the show has got.
Speaker 1:I mean, this show kind of started like the the modern age like all superhero stuff all x-rated superhero stuff, stuff like this show is like and again to my point about homelander like you're also holding one of the most important tv characters with you too. Like that's, this is a difficult piece to end on, so it's gonna be. This is gonna be a doozy for last season.
Speaker 2:Yeah it's gonna it's gonna be difficult, difficult plane to land. I mean series finales are very difficult. Like it's difficult to wrap up. You know five, you know five plus seasons of storytelling. Like it's it's hard. It's hard to do that compared to like a film where you're just it's just a one shot. Like you know, you have to just worry about the unless they do a voice film.
Speaker 1:Yeah, just kidding. Didn't they talk about that, though didn't they start. He's like I would be down to do like a movie that released in theaters five seasons in a movie um, why did we need a mandalorian and grogu movie? I don't know why does not do mandalorian season four? I?
Speaker 2:don't know. Um, yeah, I mean I'm very keen to see what happens. I mean it's this is definitely probably one of the more as far as, like fandom shows.
Speaker 1:This is probably the most anticipated series finale since thrones, probably yeah, yeah, this is gonna be one of like it's funny how I think about like social media for it. But like, when the boys is coming out, people talk like people are talking about it heavy. When this is coming out house the dragon was coming out people are talking about it heavy, like this show has a lot behind it yeah so to stick the landing is nigh impossible and no matter what people are gonna be mad all right.
Speaker 1:Well, it's, I'll. You know my theory, my stance and theory on that. It's not the fact that you're mad about the actual episode, you're mad that the thing's coming to the end, but that's your only way to kind of get your emotion out about it, yeah.
Speaker 2:So just get ready for that.
Speaker 1:Now people are gonna be mad people are mad about stuff that was actually happening and they talked about in the show. What do you think they're going to do when the show actually ends?
Speaker 2:Yeah yeah, they're going to be mad. That's it. That was fun. The boys is always a good time, so that'll do it for us this week.
Speaker 1:You want to give out some awards for this? Oh yeah, let's do that. Some awards, let's get some awards out there. The oh, I think anthony star should get his own. We should give him. Oh, I know what his award is gonna be. Um, also, where do we rank this in the? Oh no, we can't rank it in the movie tier list. We need to come up with a. We need to come up with, like a tv show tier list. Yeah, that'll be a that'll be a fun one.
Speaker 2:Um, let's start with best relationship uh, I think it's still any huey, any huey, even though obviously it had some unnecessary speed bumps, writing speed bumps that they didn't have to throw in there, I think. I still think that's the relationship I'm most behind and invested in it's ryan and butcher the best relationship out of this.
Speaker 1:this show because I Cause I don't, or maybe it's the, maybe it's kind of like the quasi tried relationship of Ryan butcher and Homelander is probably the most interesting one of. I don't know where this is going to go and I'm very afraid for not only them but a lot more people than them of whatever comes of this. And it could be a situation of like thinking about it from like a the multiverse has played out, but like a the multiverse is played out, but like a kind of like you choice will lead to a different timeline. Like maybe Ryan will always get to that point of being a villain because these are his only two options, like he doesn't have, or his third option is not to play.
Speaker 2:Yeah, which, like I said, I think that's entirely possible, that that's the path he ends up going.
Speaker 1:Most underrated character, a-train. I don't think he's underrated because of how much play he got this season.
Speaker 2:I think he's underrated because I think he just kind of the redemption arc, kind of just like they stepped on the gas finally, like it was happening like so slowly, and then they just went full send with it. So I'm just like, oh, like he's actually like. It took me like a while to realize like oh, they're actually doing it, like they're actually like they're actually gonna go full send with it and they're actually gonna like no strings attached to it, like they're actually making him, putting him on the heroic side right, um, it's hugh.
Speaker 1:It's hugh campbell. Ah, yeah, because I don't know what simon pegg I don't know what type of timing simon pegg was on when he was he. He was doing the acting. Yeah, that was probably some of the best acting in that entire show, which is awesome, uh, most heroic moment uh, I would say it's either a train beating up the deep or any beating up firecracker that's fun.
Speaker 1:I'm thinking about this more allegorically of the fact of like in universe and like the character itself, like it's just a train saving, mm. Yeah, and in front of that kid. It's like that's the definition of being a hero and it's also his like, the revelation to himself, like not only like this is what it is, but like I'm capable of doing this on top of that too, right, so good stuff by atrian um best bit homelander being disgusted by firecracker it's good.
Speaker 1:It's real funny. Real stupid, real fun. I like, I quite like the deep with Ambrosia. Yeah. Voice by Tilda. So the the octopus that's sitting in the tank, yeah. Voice by Tilda Swinton of all people, yeah.
Speaker 2:And I also I mean I also like the deep and Noir's dumb henchmen routine.
Speaker 1:It's funny, it's good. Um best battle.
Speaker 2:Probably the office fight that's good stuff.
Speaker 1:Um favorite cameo will ferrell well, oh yeah, that's such an easy one. What's that smell? Smells like oscar. Are you sure I'm not coming off?
Speaker 2:just that we talked about it when we talked about episode one through three, but just a reminder of how effortlessly funny will ferrell is.
Speaker 1:Yeah and then also what this show is. Yeah, that's something like that can happen, and like my brain didn't even like, like it wouldn't let me recognize, like the absurdity of it because of how far we've been into this show, like it wouldn't let me be like this is crazy. It's like, oh, shoot, that's just will ferrell. Um, that's one v one, um fireacker and and firecracker and starlight, yeah, because finally yeah, yeah, yeah, her getting pummeled was pretty good. Yeah, that was pretty good uh best heat check performance um marty.
Speaker 2:Come on, marty, um what was um?
Speaker 1:ah, shoot heat check performance oh, I know what mine is. This is actually pretty easy and I can't believe you're not even thinking about it are you gonna say kessler nope absolutely not. It's edgar for one episode, because john oh yeah, zito comes back for one episode and he's cooking yeah, jensen ackles laying in a tank, it's good stuff it's good stuff. His presence alone is too much. Funniest moment. Oh man you might be right about, when she gets to the stage for her show and she coughs and he's like, oh my God.
Speaker 2:It's so funny. His facial acting is just incredible. I'm trying to think of what made me laugh the most.
Speaker 1:That Will Ferrell thing the.
Speaker 2:Will Ferrell thing is, is is really funny and I was like wait a second, and he just he dials it up to full, will Ferrell, so fast that it doesn't even give you a chance to like react to it, and you're just like, oh my God, like he's. He's so funny.
Speaker 1:Um best exposition dump.
Speaker 2:Uh dump, uh. See, I like sage explaining her plan to homewander yeah, it's good.
Speaker 1:It's good. Um, what is the best? Is it learning about tech night and is somebody gonna match his nasty? Yeah so what a freak.
Speaker 2:We didn't even talk about that good, I'm glad he's dead, god he's dead zendaya.
Speaker 1:The safe word was Zendaya. What is this show man? Get him out of here. Best source material callback.
Speaker 2:I mean we're kind of we're so far removed from it, we're so far removed From the source material.
Speaker 1:I mean, it's just Tech Night. Being a freak, I guess Webweaver, webweaver. Yeah, being a freak, I guess Web Weaver.
Speaker 2:Web Weaver yeah, also a freak. Yeah, web Weaver, god, it's probably that. Or like I mean through line of like Butcher's turn to like proper villainy is like really the only through line that the show has to the source material anymore.
Speaker 1:Best NPC.
Speaker 2:It's Firecracker, but it's not for the reason that you think I was gonna say um the uh, the stunt, the stunt guy that ryan?
Speaker 1:yeah, man, rip coy, you're a real one, is it? Is it like noir in the sense of like you just get replaced and like video? Games and they just keep coming back it's like this this guy again, this guy again. That might be the most NPC actuality thought process behind it. Favorite action sequence.
Speaker 2:It's not an action sequence so much as just sequence in general. It's Homelander massacring the lab.
Speaker 1:God.
Speaker 2:Get in the oven, marty. No, no, that wasn't Marty, not Marty. What was his name? Was it David? Something like that? John the Boys Kevin.
Speaker 1:Yeah, john, the Boys Best song. It's the finale song.
Speaker 2:I forget who Is that Nirvana's song, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Good stuff, or was it when they did Old MacDonald at a Farm after the killer sheep?
Speaker 2:Favorite line mcdonald had a farm after the killer the killer sheep.
Speaker 1:Um favorite line. Um, oh, that's a good one. I don't know, do you have one? I mean, it's just that bit. It might be the scientist that came downstairs to talk to homelander when they walked into the room and she basically said like you're, you know, you're still piece of you're still a piece of us. Like you're still not really like you want to think of yourself as this dangerous man. I love the fact that she keeps calling him john. He's just like. Don't call me. Like it's like you're john to me. Like you're still john homelander, john homelander, you're still nothing to me.
Speaker 1:Like you're, you're not really anything. You could be a psycho you're. I know you're about to murder me in a second, but like you're still not gonna win, like you're still, we still have you by the balls, essentially mine.
Speaker 2:I think mine's probably like the simplest one, but it's the, it's the returning, the returning full strength butcher. Oi, oi. I was like yeah, he's back.
Speaker 1:Oh oh, it might be butchers, just like. By the way, you're all effing welcome yeah, that's good stuff.
Speaker 2:Oi, oi, I was like oh, he's back. I felt that one, the other one, the other one was like ugh, and I was like, ooh, he's sick.
Speaker 1:And now it's always like oy, and I'm like, oh yeah, he's healthy, he's good, he's back. Best world building or lore moment.
Speaker 2:Ryan being the first naturally born soup, I think is important.
Speaker 1:That's a really good one. That's a really good one. It's not all again, it's a.
Speaker 1:It's an allegorical way of thinking about it, but it's not only good for like in universe, like it feels it feels important yeah, exactly, and it's also like outside, like writing like this is that's actually a smart thing to play on of like he is he's jesus, like he's like he's, like he's the, he's your messiah. And to the point of where sage even makes the point of like people love their white guys, they love their main character white guys. Yeah, homeboy's a crazy name, though um favorite shot from this season oh it's, it's Homelander, covered in the blood yeah coming back from the elevator yeah, yeah, yeah favorite performance 3 2, 1.
Speaker 2:Anthony Starr that was easy.
Speaker 1:Favorite character uh, 3, 2, 1. Homelander. Favorite performance 3, 2, 1. Anthony Starr, that was easy. Favorite character 3, 2, 1. Homelander.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Yeah, I wanted to say Starlight for this season, but I just think a couple things just knock her down a little bit.
Speaker 1:Oh, remix mine. I'll take Sage this season because I just again, I'm a sucker for like you can't, you can beat me physically. You can't beat me. You Again, I'm a sucker for, like you can't, you can beat me physically, you can't beat me. You can't beat me intellectually, you can't.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I still can do whatever I want whenever I want. Yeah, you can kill me, but it won't matter.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah. And then, favorite moment, I think it's still probably the, just the, the, the science, the lab massacre is so insane. Yeah, and again they do the thing where they made Homelander, at least for that brief moment, they make him the protagonist, because obviously the violence is one thing, but you understand what he did and why. He did it for like the first time and like he has like a justifiable action. Yeah, we're just like wait, am I rooting for him?
Speaker 1:no, a little bit, yeah, and I mean it helps with the flashbacks. It helps that we had already seen him go through this thing and like it helps that in the beginning of the first episode they were like throwing the flashes at you of like him as a kid yeah, him with the blanket. In the beginning of the first episode they were like throwing the flashes at you of like him as a kid, him with a blanket in the lab of like and like, just he was a subject to them.
Speaker 2:But you know, I mean and honestly like, like me personally, what it reminds me of is is the, the Sephiroth realization in Final Fantasy, and like his self-discovery is you know what forces him to become who he is, and like that's what it kind of reminded me of the funniest moment from the show is firecracker squirting the milk into his mouth.
Speaker 1:I'm sorry, that's a great point, but I thought about it for a second. Because you were saying all these things about Homelander, I was like that was the funniest moment of this show. I, too, had the same expression that he had on his face.
Speaker 2:I was like what the? I didn't like it again.
Speaker 1:I'm just like, oh no, not like this. I'm going to agree with you of the whole lab sequence, my favorite that's the best. My favorite one is is it's it's not a favorite, but it's it's the death of hugh campbell. I couldn't believe like this show has some of the better acting that you'll find, but I just couldn't believe. I was like because it just came out of nowhere. I was like why is this like a? Why is this like an incredible performance? We're getting out of this. Just the whole episode itself. Yeah, um gets revealed that huey used the compound v to try to bring his dad back to life, but his dad a byproduct is his dad loses his memory. So he doesn't, or no, his memory gets reverted back. What was it, however, long ago? Like 10, 20 years or something like that. So it brings it back to when Huey was a kid. So obviously he doesn't recognize adult Huey, but he recognizes Huey's mom's also in this season.
Speaker 1:Maybe if they made Huey the main character. These would be some essential things we could talk about.
Speaker 2:Yeah, should we do our Trinity Awards, our final Trinity Awards?
Speaker 1:We have to, and then I'm going to add a new. I'm gonna add a new one. I got it. I got a new one cooking up. Um, let's get it go for it if I could find it all right, the glenn powell movie star award uh, anthony star yeah, it's easy, very easy um the john david washington, can they act award.
Speaker 2:I'm gonna ruffle some feathers don't do it, don't do't do it. No, no, no. I'm saying I'm going to say Jeffrey Dean Morgan. Wow, dude, I think he plays some offshoot of the same type of person and everything.
Speaker 1:Dude relax. Jeffrey Dean Morgan could be me personally. Jeffrey Dean Morgan, I love you man.
Speaker 2:I just like, is he just one type of character, the everything don't jason statham, him supernatural walking dead, this he's the same type of like smug, smug, smarmy, quippy kind of jerk and I'm just like, is he doing, acting, or is this just who he is?
Speaker 1:that's crazy man right lord. Um, my john david washington can they act award is going to go to? Is it ryan? I hate to do it with kid actors, I just that's a good one too always refrain from the kid actors for this um. The show has great performances across the board I know it was tough, difficult.
Speaker 2:There were a couple ones that I was like marinating with and I'm like, no, that person can act. No, no, like that's good yeah, like I can't.
Speaker 1:I can't really think of any like even like down to like thinking about it from like a different perspective. Like good acting doesn't always equate to drama. Acting like yeah the d, like chance crawford, as uh as the deep, is still an incredible performance yeah, because he plays it so well like he plays dumb so well I'm gonna plead the fifth on this. Whoa the first time.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I was cowardice in this one I put my neck out and said jeffrey d morgan you actually picked the worst possible one that you could have went with.
Speaker 1:um the denzel washington, they can act award, uh, jack quaid, jack quaid. I going to go with Simon Pegg. Yeah, that was nuts, that was insane. Jensen Ackles, jensen Ackles, wait a second, don't do it. I want to say it. I want to do it. Don't do it. I really want to do it. Jensen Ackles is cool as heck right One. Jensen Ackles is cool as heck right. One of the coolest guys you can find. But can he act? I've been saying, cause he's got that like rough around edged, like if I were to like give a person, like if I were to give AI do Captain America, that's who he was or he's either the smug guy that's cool in the corner of the bar, he's like early 2000's Chris Evans or he's, or he's either the smug guy that's cool in the corner of the bar, he's.
Speaker 2:He's like early 2000s chris evans or he's or he's 2019 chris evans.
Speaker 1:So I beg the question I mean he's got.
Speaker 2:I mean he's got 15 years of supernatural under his belt, and then, and then he's got the boys and you made a good point of like why wasn't he doing more things like that?
Speaker 1:was jensen ackles properly? Uh, because he was in. Am I crazy, he's in dawson's he's dawson's creek right. So like dawson's creeps is supernatural, and I'm like you. Why was he not on like a star? He's got the hollywood name jensen ackles. It's a hollywood name. I beg the question can jensen ackles act?
Speaker 2:it's fair. That's what. That's what the awards were.
Speaker 1:That's the spirit of the award uh the a24, let the director cook award is easily.
Speaker 2:Episode four yes, yes, it is, let's get this.
Speaker 1:No, I'm remixing mine, taking away my a24. Let the direct, let the creators cook award will go to them, not being afraid to to go after the real world events that's a good point let's talk about it. Let's talk about it um the hugh jackman. Is he him, she her or they've?
Speaker 2:had my word um john carlos pasito, because he stepped, because you know what it's. It's the exact. Like some of these awards are simple in the sense that, like as soon as he showed back up, I'm like he's him.
Speaker 1:Yeah this man walked out of jail and somehow found a suit like I don't like. How'd you do that? That was cool yeah, so like yeah, it's jacob esposito right like, sometimes these are very, these are very simple ones, so I will, I'll, I will abide by that one, I will live with that one. Wow, this show has an 8.7 on imtp. That is, that is wild. Um, my, I'm gonna go with.
Speaker 2:I'm gonna go with the victoria newman actor oh, claudia, I don't know how to say her last name I knew from when.
Speaker 1:Oh, it could have been sage too, but in terms of because this is an actor, predicated award, this isn't a yeah, this isn't a character predicated award but, um, I mean, I told, like, I said like that's a proper, good secondary villain to have in a show of like yeah, and she kept getting more and like they set it up first episode like, oh, shoot, she can't die and she could also kill anybody at any moment's notice too. Yeah, but she won't. Well, when she walked into that barn and she or into like that little lab piece and she started making all their nosebleeds, I was like, oh, that's power, yeah, that's the j, that's the yeah no, power is not not.
Speaker 1:No, no power is power. Yeah, um, my new award, the anthony star unhinged performance award oh, he wins, he wins, he wins his own award. You won the first award of yours. I'm actually gonna not pick him for this.
Speaker 2:No, he has to win.
Speaker 1:No no, no, I'm picking sage for this award specifically. You know why? I still don't know what she wants and again, I just think she's having a big global destabilization. Laugh, yeah, I think she's just like. This has been a good time yeah, that's fair man good, good television, good tv, yeah, still good tv like any.
Speaker 2:Any criticisms we have are pretty nitpicky compared to personal yeah, compared to you know other shows that we have right like the acolyte.
Speaker 2:I don't want to keep kicking the acolyte, but it was right. It's got good stuff in it. It was right there. The characters isn't one of them. It was right there. Like, sometimes it's a fringe criticism, sometimes it's it's a bit heavier of a criticism and I feel like any criticisms we made of of this as just fringe, kind of nitpicky stuff, um, but overall it's still really, really, really good. Um, that's it. That's going to do it for us this week. What'd you been doing, man? Uh, what have I been doing? I've been re-watching Thrones. That's what I've been doing.
Speaker 1:How far did you get?
Speaker 2:I've just finished season one.
Speaker 1:Oh no, ned Stark, time.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I finished season one and watched the first episode of season two. It's fun, it's fun, it's fun. I've never re-watched the entirety of Thrones since before season eight. I I've never done a rewatch of Thrones with season eight included, so I've only ever seen season eight once. Um the final season.
Speaker 2:Like I only saw it the year that it aired and I haven't gone back to it since. Um, so I mean it's cool. It's cool, you know, going back in time and seeing especially the characters that are still alive by the time you get to season eight, um kind of like seeing where they were and where they end up, um, is really, really fun.
Speaker 1:Good, I like it. I just finished the umbrella Academy too. I don't know if we're going to talk about it, um, just talk about sticking the landing infinitely Like, unfortunately me, unfortunately for me to say not a good last season and it's just a show that I loved that show. I loved that show so much I used to scream to the mountains, especially season one and two, how good the alt superhero stuff. This is some of the best alt superhero stuff you can have. It's great character work too. That show notoriously had really good characters in it Abandoned 90% of that in this final season.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'll say this for the last season the last season should have been packaged into what season two's budget was and hype anticipation. That treatment needed to be onto this season for what they were trying to achieve. And, like I can tell, this season didn't have nearly the budget that those other seasons had. Specifically, season two did not have the budget that it had. I I made that point to you that, like Netflix had been in this way of like their original content Wasn't like, especially the shows like stranger things in the low season right now, like mine hunters done like umbrella academy was one of those shows that they had of like, look like this is one of the shows that we had. Like they waited too long, like it'd been, like we'd already been away from it for so long. So when was the last season of umbrella academy? 2022?
Speaker 1:yeah, so it had already. It had been two years, which is fine, like that's. That's not a big deal that it'd been two years, it's just the fact that you know you, you abandoned all the feeling like this show lost the feeling that I used to get from watching it big time and again. That comes through the characters, like the decisions this season are just like head scratching like I just some of the things that were happening.
Speaker 1:Like I, physically, like I, I couldn't believe it. I was just like this, just this just usurps everything that you were doing for for three seasons and like season three isn't some like Emmy award level season Still fun, it's still a good time. So a lot of, like you know, bigger world building stuff that goes on in there too. It's just this season doesn't feel like it's a part of that same show. That's how I thought I was looking at it. Like this doesn't feel like it belongs here.
Speaker 1:So yeah it's just unfortunate. Um, it was only six episodes, so again, budgetary. Like I can tell that they took a lot of it away. Um, yeah, it's just. It's just frustrating. Like they're still good, they're still solid bits. Like, as much as some of the character decisions don't make sense. Like the performances are still the performances. Like you still get what you, what you needed out of everybody too. It's just I. I feel like there was a netflix constraint on this season and this might be one of the most apparent versions of that yeah, which is a netflix issue that they, you know, final seasons of, of these Netflix shows rarely ever hit the mark.
Speaker 1:You made that point of? Is Netflix kind of cooked? Are they to the point of? This is what their original content is? Are they going to treat everything like this? I told you, the only one that they're not going to do it for is Stranger Things. That's the only one that's probably going to hold its quality throughout the last second of the last season.
Speaker 2:It happened to this. Um, I want to. I want to hope that it won't happen to the witcher, but it, yeah, it's going to, especially without henry cavill too, like it's I, I, I sense a mail-in season coming, yeah, for season four of the witcher, and it's unfortunate because I do. I do want to give liam hemsworth a shot, but I, I just feel like the, the netflix is just like look, we just gotta get these out, get it out there yeah, maybe in the future we can talk about the streaming wars maybe we'll title the episode the streaming wars because,
Speaker 1:you know, netflix was not only for just getting content onto a streaming service and just, you pay a bad amount of money. Like the revolutionary nature of it, like it was their original content that made it be like I'll never forget. Like the coin flip in my mind was when the irishman, like when scorsese said, no, I'm gonna make a movie, I was like what the what are you? Yeah, what are you doing? Like you, you make movies for the movies. Like he's like no, I like this is a place I can distribute my movie. Like why, what does it matter? So I'm putting my movie here. Um, it's gonna be released in theater still, so it's fine, but this is gonna come to streaming like same, like same time. And I was like, wow, like these streaming services have credibility for not only just like television, but like actual films too. So and netflix was the first top dog for this they, they were the first one to be like we can do this, we can make our own things. Then Stranger Things catches fire. They acquire Cobra Kai, you had Mindhunter. How many original television shows that they have that were must-watches for everybody.
Speaker 1:But now it's almost like there's a uniformity that comes with Netflix. A bunch of their content feels similar to itself. Yeah, um, I also like to get technical with it Like they only allow a certain type of cameras to be used. Like it's it's the Netflix to prove, like that that's a term that's always thrown out Like you have. Like Netflix only approves a certain amount of cameras, and I think this is a more of like a like a psychological, philosophical debate to think about it this way. But like it's almost like they want the uniformity. So like your brain thinks oh, I'm watching Netflix. Like it's Netflix. Like if this isn't like something that came over from, like properties wise, if this is an original thing. Like this is a Netflix thing that I'm watching. Yeah, their subtitles are notoriously different from all the other streaming services. Subtitles Like this is like a Netflix thing that you're watching and I want you to know it's a Netflix thing you're watching.
Speaker 1:Versus Apple TV like Max is the top, like Max has the best, or HBO has the best original content you can find. Now Apple TV is like Apple TV and Amazon are probably battling for that second spot. Um, disney's probably after that, and probably what's helping Disney is Hulu, it's like the, the. It's probably like the Fox stuff is probably what's helping that FX, like that's helping them a lot in terms of like the original content. Yeah, um, that's pretty much it. And then you kind of like just get into like the throes of like your, your, your. Paramount's not bad, paramount, but paramount has a lot of properties behind it too peacock's the same way peacock is like paramount, like they had the properties with them as well too.
Speaker 1:Uh, paramount's on the up and or, uh, peacock's on the up and up, though they're starting to get. Yeah, they have the nbc stuff, which helps, and it's also like the non narrative stuff, like the sports stuff, like that peacock just had the biggest global sports event you can have.
Speaker 2:Yeah the Olympics. Yeah, like those things are important.
Speaker 1:But in terms of like original content that I'm looking at everything, like Netflix like dropped the ball a bit, like they were uncontested and now it's like I don't need my Netflix subscription anymore. It's how it feels a lot of the times. It's like I need HBO Max. Like I need Max, yes, yeah. It's like I need hbo max. Like I need max, yes, yeah. Like I need disney plus. Like I need paramount. Like I do I need netflix anymore.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's a great point. That's a great point um socials. You can follow us on twitter at projects inf underscore pod. You can follow us on facebook. You can follow us on youtube at the project infinite podcast. You can follow us on instagram.
Speaker 1:That's a project infinite pod week.
Speaker 2:I don't know what we're going to do next week.
Speaker 1:Yeah, who knows who's to say.
Speaker 2:Who knows?
Speaker 1:I don't know for sure.
Speaker 2:We don't know for sure. Happy birthday, Andrew Garfield.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it was Andrew Barfield's birthday yesterday.
Speaker 2:The patron saint of the podcast, yeah he turned 41.
Speaker 1:Still young. That's the most 28-year-old-looking 41-year-old I've ever seen in my life. It's crazy.
Speaker 2:Unfortunately, the movie that we think he might win an Oscar for is getting memed now because of a horse.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, not the horse. The horse on the carousel made its way onto the internet, and now the horse has become a meme. Why are we like this as people.
Speaker 2:I mean, it's a pretty funny-looking horse, it is funny.
Speaker 1:I just because, like you don't even think about it in the poster, and then you saw it and you're like what?
Speaker 2:the, so his Oscar dreams might have been dashed by a meme. No, that actually might help.
Speaker 1:It might help, might help, we'll see that movie's probably going to be.
Speaker 2:The movie's going to be really sad, probably just going to demolish everybody. Yeah, the movie's going to be really sad. I'm already waiting.
Speaker 1:Looking forward to anything coming out soon. I was thinking about this where it's. It's about to be my bag of the year.
Speaker 2:My, it's about to be my time of the year. It's about to be oscar season. Um, trying to think what's I don't know what's coming up what are you? Doing. I'm going to, I'm going to fan expo and tomorrow, nice, nice uh, in toronto who's going? To be there. John carlos is going to be there. Heck, yeah, you better meet him, um, seemingly. Who's going to be there? Giancarlo?
Speaker 1:Esposito is going to be there.
Speaker 2:Heck, yeah, you better meet him. Sima Liu is going to be there.
Speaker 1:Ask him where Shang-Chi 2 is at.
Speaker 2:Friend of the show. Marina Baccarin is going to be there, Catherine Han and Joe Locke are going to be there to talk about some Agatha stuff. I think that's on Friday, so I'm going to try and Can you just tell Marina Bachar.
Speaker 1:And I said hi, yeah.
Speaker 2:I will. That's all I want.
Speaker 1:Just tell her. My boy, my guy Kort, said hi, She'll know what's going on, I think, 4.30 on Friday.
Speaker 2:Catherine Hahn and Joe Lock are doing an Agatha panel. Squeeze into that Um sneak in there. I mean you can go to all the panels and stuff. It's all that's. That's all free Once you get in um there's going to be a thousand people there. Uh, friday, if I remember last year, friday, thursday, friday is not busy, saturday is insanely crowded. Um Sunday is not too crowded, but Saturday um, that's, that's gonna happen. Um, cameron mornahan will be there.
Speaker 1:uh, tamera morrison will be there. Ben mckenzie, gotham's own, yes, um, I wonder why he's gonna be there. Morena bakran, almost like they're married dolph lundgren will be there.
Speaker 2:He killed apollo creed get him out of there, um, and then a host of um.
Speaker 2:You know anime voice actors will be there. Video game voice actors will be there. Comic creators will be there. I know jeff john actors will be there. Video game voice actors will be there. Comic creators will be there. I know Jeff Johns will be there. Um, um, yeah, so I'm, I'm looking forward to that. I went last year and I'm going again this year, so it's going to be a fun time, awesome, yeah, um, so that'll do it for us. Next week, like I said, we'll marinate on some things the iRobot episode, maybe, maybe, it might be time. So that'll do it for us. From me, from the what are we talking about? The boys, oh, careful.
Speaker 2:I do gotta be real careful, Careful man.
Speaker 1:As soon as I hear the mmm from Eminem, I'm gonna be like you gotta sit outside, yeah, look you're the one said he was, he was dig this season.
Speaker 2:So you didn't even let me finish my point about him being dig, uh, from the hugh campbell of the podcast hugh campbell yeah, I die.
Speaker 1:I mean I die, but I give a great performance yeah, I mean, I don't really.
Speaker 2:There's really the boys. There's no good way out of this. You could have just said Huey, nah, nah, nah, I don't know there's something about Huey that I just I don't, I don't know, I don't like it, I don't like the comparison.
Speaker 1:Is it because he's 6'2" and they joke about it the season that he's 6'2 and he can't fight?
Speaker 2:Yeah so maybe we'll do iRobot next week. That'll be fun.
Speaker 1:Goddamn robots, John. What's the funniest movie we can do next week?
Speaker 2:Madam Web, moonfall. What if the moon's not what you think?
Speaker 1:What do you mean? Roland Emmerich? What does that mean? Why is Patrick Wilson in here? What does that mean? Was Halle Berry in that movie? Yep.
Speaker 2:Jesus, madame Webb.
Speaker 1:Ooh Kingdom of the Planet of the Apes we never talked about. I don't believe.
Speaker 2:We didn't.
Speaker 1:We didn't. Yeah, good movie, good movie. That I think we both were pretty dang surprised at, yeah, and I think it's a good conversation on modern franchising too.
Speaker 2:Yeah, on modern franchising too. Yeah, the ape-averse. Come on man, but yeah, we'll figure something out. So from me, I already signed off, and from you, the Hugh Campbell of the podcast.
Speaker 1:I'm doubling down. I don't know how I feel about it.
Speaker 2:We will see you next week. Goodbye Peace.
