The Project Infinite Podcast
A Podcast Spanning The Ever Expanding Infinite Multiverse of Fandom. From movies, to TV, to comics, to the world of gaming, we have you covered at every corner with thoughts, opinions, commentary and a little bit of comedy too.
The Project Infinite Podcast
148 - Reimagining DC's Future: Dream Projects for the New Universe
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The first two episodes of Daredevil: Born Again have arrived, and we're breaking down everything that makes this revival special. Charlie Cox returns in spectacular form as Matt Murdock, bringing both emotional depth and physical prowess to a character caught between his two identities. This struggle between man and beast isn't unique to our hero—Wilson Fisk faces the same internal battle, creating a fascinating parallel between hero and villain that elevates the storytelling.
What immediately stands out is how the show blends the gritty, character-driven approach of the Netflix series with subtle elements that connect it to the broader MCU. Performance-wise, the cast delivers across the board—Vincent D'Onofrio remains magnetic as Kingpin, Wilson Bethel terrifies as Bullseye, and the late Kamar De Los Reyes makes an immediate impact as White Tiger.
The episode culminates in yet another pitch meeting, where we imagine our dream DC Universe projects. From a gritty Red Hood crime thriller directed by John Woo to an epic Kingdom Come adaptation with Josh Brolin as an aged Batman, we explore what makes these characters special and how their stories could be brought to life by the right creative teams.
Thank you to everyone who continues to support and don’t forget to subscribe to download new episodes as they become available and don’t be afraid to share a rating!
0:00 Intro
00:45 Daredevil: Born Again Episodes 1 & 2
09:20 More Odyssey Casting!
13:30 Paapa Essiedu cast as Snape in Harry Potter MAX Series
18:14 Avengers Concept Art
28:34 Last of Us Trailer
35:20 Andor Season 2 Trailer
38:46 Thunderbolts Cinema Trailer
45:20 DC Studios Pitch Meeting! Our Ideas For DC TV, Movies & Special Presentations
01:43:46 Signing Off!
Topic for Next Week: Avengers: Doomsday Cast Reveal & Speculation
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Speaker 2:Podcast Go tell your friends it's the Infinite Podcast.
Speaker 1:My God, it never ends. It's the Infinite Podcast with Rob and Kork the Cube.
Speaker 2:Hello everybody and welcome back to another episode of Project Infinite Podcast, the podcast covering the infinite and ever-expanding multiverse of fandom for movies, comics, tv shows, video games. We got you covered. I'm rob. I'm here, as always, with court in court. We are fresh into daredevil, born again yes um, so the first two episodes are out. Third episode is out tonight. Um, I guess we could just come off top and just start quick kind of thoughts on the first two episodes.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean one thing that I'm really appreciating out of the gate and how I'm feeling, is the apprehensiveness to a new platform, the apprehensiveness to a new, you know kind of way to give us this new show, new show, quote, unquote, new show and kind of the approach, everything that we've kind of taken. It's alleviated, like I feel like a, like a sigh of relief to say and like happy to report back that the show's good, um, the show's gripping, like it gets you out of the gate. It really gets you right out of the gate, like one opening, the structure. That opening was intentful I maybe we don't go into spoilers into what happened, but man, how to like no better way and it also gives you an immediate intrigue for structured storytelling as well, too. For people that didn't watch the, the netflix show, like they can get in, find a way to navigate as well through and then become curious to go back through.
Speaker 1:Is this as easy as saying you don't have to watch it? No, I, I don't think this is as easy to be like. You could just start fresher, you can't. In my opinion, you can. You do need to watch those three seasons of Daredevil, but what we're given here, it's very fully realized versions of these characters. These feel like the prime versions of all these characters, which I really appreciate. I just can't overstate how good Charlie Cox is as Daredevil. It is to the point. Bless you.
Speaker 2:Bless you again. Are we keeping that in? Yeah, we're keeping that in, keeping the sneezes in.
Speaker 1:It's to the point where he's.
Speaker 2:Jesus.
Speaker 1:All right, I love you, charlie. I don't think this doesn't mean I don't love you. He's got it out of his system now. He's just otherworldly as he's, so himself as Matt Murdock. I mean it's and that's the piece. He's himself as Matt Murdock as much as he is as Daredevil, and that's an important part going into the show. You know his, his kind of reversion into into the. You know thedoch murdoch versus the beast of the daredevil, and it's something that he's fighting with. That's one of the, that's one of the early themes of this movie of like you and your darker half, which one should be the one that reigns supreme and is your darker half, you like, is that you? That's really one of the themes and I'm happy to also report that doesn't just go for matt, that also goes for wilson fist, for king yep, that's.
Speaker 2:One of my favorite things, at least about the first two episodes, is that Matt and Fisk are both. They're truly two sides of the same coin and they're both battling against their darker halves battling against, some would argue, their better or worse hatreds.
Speaker 2:And they directly confront one another. On that fact, you know, which I really appreciate and I'm really looking forward to seeing how that develops. And that appears to be the kind of through line of what this season is going to be about is kind of reconciling with yourself, in a manner of speaking, and yeah, I mean, everything's great. I think that the entry into the greater Marvel superhero cinematic universe hasn't been terribly jarring. I think they do a lot of cool stuff, um to kind of show off his powers in a different way, in a more kind of super heroic way, um, like a more kind of like superhuman way than than the netflix show did, which I think you know. I think as he progresses um, you probably progresses in the MCU they're easing us into he's a little bit more than just a regular guy who's kind of gifted. He actually has some superhuman ability.
Speaker 1:Right, it's like a band-aid that needs to be ripped off and I think, because he was encapsulated in She-Hulk and then Echo kind of brings him back into the Daredevil Netflix territory, where it's like there was a line that needed to be drawn and I think that they kind of met in the middle of both of them as well too, like swinging around the city like he does in the comics and he's taking these hits and like he looks a little.
Speaker 1:You know, obviously there's some adjustments that are going to need to be made, because I went back and I watched the first episode and the first and second episode of the first season of Daredevil and it's like this is a transition piece in terms of the in-suit fighting style, because obviously I hate to use the terminology MCU-ified, like I don't like it, but definitely it's, it's an adjustment piece. It's not this gritty hand-to-hand way of fighting anymore. It's a little bit more comic booky now. Like it's like and that was again that was thank god for she-hulk that we didn't just jump from the netflix show to this like I will say thank god for shemale, for uh, for she-hulk, to kind of be like hey, we can, we can ease into this a little bit.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah for sure. And then just the other thing, like just rounding out kind of. I think what hopefully everyone can agree upon is just the performances across the board, from top to bottom, are stellar, obviously with Charlie Cox and Vincent D'Onofrio obviously, and then Debra Ann Wohl I thought in her kind of little bit of time that she's gotten so far in these first two episodes. It was just absolutely incredible. Um, and then my, my standout is kind of like also a little bit, a little bit of tragedy, but obviously behind it.
Speaker 2:but Kamar De Los Reyes says, as white tiger, um, I'm really looking forward to seeing more of that character, because there's, you know, sometimes like a guy just shows up on screen and starts doing the acting and you're like, oh, this guy, like he kind of has like a similar vibe to how it's not quite how magnetic Bernthal was when he showed up in season two of Daredevil, but it's like it's entering that kind of stratosphere and you can tell that there's a real weight behind that character.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And I'm just really looking forward to seeing more of him. And I mean, unfortunately this is going to be, you know, his only kind of outing in the MCU because he passed away from cancer a couple years ago.
Speaker 1:But I was really, really, really into that character in that second episode really, really into that character in that second episode, when our wilson bethel as bullseye is one of the most inspired castings in the mcu, like how formidable, how absolutely psychotic, how much of a lover of the game he is of, like being a, a psychopathic assassin, like I love the game, I love it, like I love the animosity it brings, I love you know, and again it's. That's a great example of how to transition from a comic to a television show and not make it feel cheesy. Like he does feel like the same assassin that he was, but he feels bolstered. Everybody feels a little bit like heftier in this show, if that makes sense yes, yeah, 100.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean his again short outing as as returning to, as bullseye was it was. You couldn't have asked for a better kind of just stint of action from him, right? Um, everything that you remember about point dexter from season three of daredevil is again, again, like you said, amplified. Everything in his hands is a weapon of just utter chaos and destruction. He's just so unrelenting and merciless, not even in the one major action that he takes, but in the ensuing action. You see how merciless he is, because you get this feeling and obviously I'm not going to dive into spoilers, but you get this feeling that he did the major thing that he does Feels like it was done with intent. Yes, what that intent is, we don't know yet, but again, he loves the game, right? So when the action breaks down and he starts freewheeling, you really get a sense of how chaotic he is. So, yeah, overall the first two episodes were great.
Speaker 2:They're planting Punisher seeds already, which I feel like is just the big moment everyone's waiting for, understandably so, and we're going to talk about some Punisher stuff in a little bit. So, yeah, I just wanted to get our kind of thoughts out there on the first two episodes, um. But today our main topic of discussion is going to be we're going to remix our pitch meeting idea from when we did the Marvel stuff um, which was really, really fun, and we're going to remix that to some DC stuff, especially as the DC, the new DC universe, kind of gets kick-started. We're going to just throw out some ideas of stuff that maybe we want to see. I'm going to try and keep it to either newer stuff or stuff that hasn't been announced and just kind of take it from there. But first we do have some news, starting with, of course I almost said Oppenheimer casting. Come on, odyssey casting. Why did he go with another O title? It's throwing me off, maybe that's his bag.
Speaker 2:Um. So just again we're we're at the stage of the christopher nolan casting where we're getting these kind of like b to c list actors and we're just we're rounding out the group, um, people that again, like are just going to be probably in the movie for a couple minutes and then they're going to be gone, but they're, they're, they're pretty notable names. Um, so cory hawkins obviously is is the most recent casting, I think. Um, you might know him from a couple things. Um, straight out of compton probably is his big not as not as well. I guess maybe it is kind of his big break because he was also in Black Klansman. I know him from 24 Legacy.
Speaker 2:I was very excited for that show and it was okay. He's good in it. So I think that's great. I think it's great for all the names that I'm going to bring up. It's great for them to kind of get, because you're kind of I guess I mean this is kind of reductive to say about Jack Quaid, but like Jack Quaid being an Oppenheimer and now you're kind of seeing like it kind of like justifies a lot of Nolan's casting choices, when you point to like, oh, like he was only in this movie for like two seconds and now they're like a major movie star. So it just shows you that he's casting people with purpose and people that he, in some scale and degree, wants to work with right um, so that's very cool.
Speaker 2:Um our channel favorite, cosmo jarvis. Um has been cast as well. Um, I think that's super cool for him. Um obviously just a uh star making performance in shogun.
Speaker 2:Yep it's not proper that we talked about ad nauseum, for I think it's still on record as our longest episode is the Shogun episode, which is great again, especially for someone like him who does not have an extensive filmography outside of really. Shogun is where he kind of obviously broke out. Right Right Did like an episode of a couple episodes of peaky blinders, like he's been around like the british tv circuit and now obviously shogun was his big boom and now he's being cast in a nolan film, which I think is really really cool. And then the last one is jovan adepo has been cast. Um what was he in again he was in baby.
Speaker 1:He was in a few more things as well, too.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so yeah, I mean, and then I guess we didn't really. I don't think we ever touched upon the Matt Damon thing, right, that he is Odysseus.
Speaker 1:Yes, he's playing Odysseus and then Tom Holland's playing Odysseus' son.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:So, like a dual lead actor, matt Damon's the real lead actor. He's getting the Killian Murphy treatment. He's been Nolan's guy since Interstellar, like one of his side guys since Interstellar, and you're finally going to get to be the, be the main role, yeah, and maybe get a best, best actor. Now I'm out of this as well too.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think I think again. But this Odyssey thing, um, I like that we're doing this bit again because before you know it, this movie's going to be out or we're going to be getting a trailer. And man, just what a cast. And again, just the idea that this story one of the first stories ever is finally going to be adapted to film is awesome. It's an awesome undertaking that Nolan is embarking on with this movie and I'm really looking forward to it. Still, we got some trailers Actually, no, let's save the trailers. We got some more casting stuff. So the Harry Potter TV show at HBO Max is starting to round out. We have John Lithgow casting, the first one where I'm just like, okay, again, what's the time frame of these things? Because John Lithgow is in his 80s. All respect to him, he's a tremendous, tremendous actor. He's going to be playing Dumbledore. Then Papa Asidu has been cast as Severus Snape, and you can guess what the reaction to that was.
Speaker 1:How sad, yeah, how sad, like the apparel it was. So I mean, you know what it reminded me of when what's name got cast as Finn in Force Awakens, john Boyega. Yeah, when John Boyega was cast, that's exactly how it felt. Like how dare you infringe upon our precious, very one-colored franchise? How dare you? Yeah, about magical wizards. Yeah, so it's fine, it's okay.
Speaker 2:It's okay, it's okay, guys yeah, I mean, and I know people are, are you know, just there is.
Speaker 2:There's a couple issues, not issues with the casting, but issues that this raises and it honestly highlights kind of like one of the flaws in the writing of the original harry potter stories where the thing with the thing with the big aha moment, the big plot reveal around Snape's character is obviously he had this massive affection for Harry Potter's mother and he was like bullied essentially by James Potter and I just it's gonna read.
Speaker 2:It's gonna read really, really awkwardly to have the Jamesames potter character essentially bullying and picking on who will essentially be a young black character and it's just gonna read. It already takes in weird situation, yeah, and now makes it even weirder, right. So I hope they're mindful of that and right to it, if that makes sense, because obviously race in the Harry Potter universe is not touched upon outside of the magical aspect of it. Obviously the elves are looked down upon or the goblins are looked down upon and there's a whole bunch of racial allegorical stuff that goes on there, but the actual idea of white and black and hispanic and and the actual, like real world races is never touched upon. So maybe I mean maybe they can surprise me and remix it a little bit- yeah and kind of bring a little bit of real world stuff into it.
Speaker 2:I think that would help it. Yeah, a little bit like write to it, like don't be afraid to write to it. I guess would be my biggest kind of advice, like, if you're gonna do this and you're gonna, you know, kind of put this guy in into the forefront of a controversy that he does not deserve nor ask for, yeah, um, I would hope you at least have the mind and the wherewithal to kind of write to that a little bit and address it, um, within the confines of the show, because I think because of how the storyline plays out with those characters, it becomes important now. So I mean, we'll see again. I have pretty low expectations for this, just because, like, I think the original set of films was a one in a million chance that it worked to the degree that it did. I mean finding those three young actors at the time in emma, emma watson, uh, rupert grint you're catching lightning in an absolute bottle.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's what you're doing, and you don't have that same wherewithal for this show, and it's still. You know, I'm hoping nothing for the best for everybody.
Speaker 2:That's going to work for the show that's my biggest thing, but I'm just.
Speaker 1:I'm getting so much fear from what this show could be and I really hope I'm proven wrong. Me too, I want to be wrong.
Speaker 2:but I mean, and also not just the stroke of luck to find these great young actors at the time, but then also surrounding them with these, I mean who's who of adult talent. I mean you're talking about Ralph Fiennes, you're talking about Maggie Smith. Yes, you know.
Speaker 1:Gary Oldman, richard Harris, like tennis actors and actresses.
Speaker 2:Alan Rickman, obviously, you obviously talking about Snape. You surrounded these young, impressionable, not even up-and-coming actors new actors you hear about.
Speaker 2:Daniel Radcliffe telling the story of how he was cast as Harry Potter. It was like a one-in-a-million shot for him. None of these kids really acted at the time and then the it was like I said, it was a perfect cultivation of of surrounding these, getting these young actors, and then surrounding them with just incredible adult, mature talent. That was kind of foster them, you know. Um. So, yeah, I mean, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm intrigued, but I'm not necessarily excited, right, but we'll see. We'll see what happens. Secret Wars, let's talk about it. Yeah, got some leaks. Yeah, you want to talk. You want to talk about this?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean can I start with how the new, the new Russo Brothers movie was one of the worst rated movies of the year so far. We don't have to talk about that. That's not fair. That's not fair. What we will talk about is how these leaks are absolutely insane. It almost looks like. So what did we get out of these leaks? We got God, emperor Doom. That was a good thing.
Speaker 1:So they're pulling I mean, obviously they're pulling from hickman's secret wars run like they actually said today, they're pulling from the 80s and the 2010s secret wars they're gonna pull some stuff from the beyonder which lends critics credence to the fact that I think that the original plan was to make a version of the. Kang's whole thing was going to be to become a version of the beyonder to go into the secret wars, and then that's kind of how the and he and kang himself, kang prime was just going to replace dr doom in the story, but now they're just actually going to do dr doom. So we see this like super kind of you know, ancient, not ancient looking, but it was like all, like the king, like the, the god emperor's doom, medieval, yeah, yeah and it. I mean it looked raw, like it looked. It looked pretty crazy. Like yelena is like the.
Speaker 1:Like the black widows are essentially like their police force, which is kind of cool, trading out the thors. If they're gonna do that. Like the thor core probably gets traded out for like all the widows. Um, strange is still there by his side, just like in the comics there. Um, sue store. Uh, vanessa kirby's there. Like sue storm's there, you know her, which also makes the most sense. I think that robert downey jr is going to show up at the end of fantastic four.
Speaker 1:It's you have to get us ready somehow you have to get everybody ready, rip the band-aid, because if, if, what I'm hearing, and if this fantastic four movie is as immaculate as some people, like the pre-screenings are saying, and like the the um, the test audience school, like people, like people are saying like, if you're going to do it, that's the best way to bookend it, put it right in there. So, uh, and you want to, if you're going to do this correctly, if you're going to attack secret wars like this, and like one of the big things we're talking about is who's the main character? Right, like we've been talking about who's going to be the main character of this thing, or main characters Like, yeah, just super track Reed Richards to be the main character. I mean, you got Pedro Pascal for a reason. Don't, don't waste it at a time like this. So, very simple, just fast track the. Keep it. Very simple, that's it. That's all you got to do, in my opinion, like, don't, don't overcomplicate this, just have the two of them against each other. Very simple. So we got she's no, no, she's not a Nexus being. So that got debunked out of Multiverse of Madness.
Speaker 1:But also to your point, I think what's going to happen is she's going to be the one that she's going to be the catalyst to hit the boom to get the start of the, just like the Molecule man was. So I think, whatever happens, and like you said, she's such like this incredible character that can be utilized in the right way, that might be the coolest way to be. Like her reintroduction is the scarlet witch of each universe, or like the wanda maximoff of each universe, is the one that's actually the catalyst behind everything. She's the only one powerful, powerful enough to do any of these things too. So, um, speaking of that, the reason I'm bringing up is the children's crusade from the young avengers comics like. That's probably what they're going to try to do. That might be a big portion of this. So who was it? It was kamala, it was kate cassie yeah, wicked in speed.
Speaker 1:Um, I'm still upset that patriots not there. I think they're going to retroactive that, especially like I don't know what the problem is of like patriots, a founding member of the young avengers in the comics like. And it also sucks that Kang's not there because not having not utilizing a younger really good younger actor to play, you know, to play Iron man, to lead the young Avengers, to be the main character of this movie along, cause you're going to make Yelena. You're going to do what Kate Bishop, what you did with Yelena. Like her and Kamala are going to be the two main characters of this thing, yeah, of whatever this Young Avengers movie happens, which I do think they're going to probably try to speed track before Secret Wars comes out.
Speaker 2:Come on man Speed track eh, come on, come on, that makes a lot of sense. Yeah, what's Star-Lord up to in these? Star-lord's doing a lot.
Speaker 1:He's going to be like, because Vision was there too in that leak, which makes sense because it's starwood yeah, they were chilling on the couch together well, I think star lord's probably like you know, the cool uncle, exactly, exactly, exactly like he's like, but I just don't know how he gets in with them who knows?
Speaker 2:he's on earth now. So he's on earth, yeah I mean, who knows?
Speaker 1:yeah, obviously, I think the only reason we didn't see any like avengers leaks is because they still don't know who the Avengers are, which I think, again, it would be really smart to build the Avengers team that Sam's going to make. The young Avengers are trying to because and you know, your, your catalyst into that is Wiccan and speed are like we need to go get my mom. Like my mom, like I need to. Like our mom is, you know, being held by Dr Doom in this universe. Like we need to go get her. Will, like our mom, is you know, being held by Dr Doom in this universe? Like we need to go get her.
Speaker 1:Will you guys help us and like after recruitment, like this is our mission, the main Avengers and then the Thunderbolts, like the Thunderbolts are, like you know, obviously like the void, is you know, down Now we have the century. Like we are a powerful team, like let's, like it's going to be three Avengers fronts to try to do that and they're all going to lose. And then that fourth secret one I think is going to be that multiversal team, like that what I think is going to happen, and the post-credits scene of Captain America 4 kind of lends to this as well, too. I wonder if they're going to do a situation and like this is what the rumors were originally of like the event, they're all going to come together like. They're going to be like great Thunderbolts, young Avengers, new Avengers, like we're all together doing great Perfect, they're going to immediately lose. They're going to lose and you know what they're going to lose to a team of all these different characters that we grew up watching.
Speaker 1:Like, and they're going to be like it's your universe against mine. Like choose. Like we're going to have to pick. So I can see a version of that unfolding. Yeah, le, so I can see a version of that unfolding. Yeah, leaks were crazy. The leaks were we didn't even talk about the Hulk one Hulk and She-Hulk. Doing a version of Planet Hulk as well, too, was crazy.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So I mean, if this is the type of stuff they're cooking up again, I think the Russos do a tremendous job. I think they get a bad. Them and Downey have caught a pretty bad rep, I guess.
Speaker 1:I don't overtly understand it.
Speaker 2:Like I find it a bit Like. I think it's a little reductive. I've seen this criticism come out about Downey recently where, like he's just doing this for the check and I'm like when has he ever given that idea that he doesn't put his all into anything that he's doing? And according to the Russos, he is doing that Like he is absorbing this Dr Doom character and kind of you know, he's absorbing the lore of the character and then kind of remixing it, I guess, which I'm okay with.
Speaker 2:Um, I think one of the things people forget most often about how this whole thing started was they took the character of Iron man and totally remixed it from how he is historically in the comics to the point where now the Tony Stark that we grew up literally grew up with from 2008 to now is kind of like the defining type of Iron man, like when you see him appear in animation, when you see him appear in video games. Now he has a lot of the downy-isms instead of being the kind of cold, calculated dickhead that he historically is in the comics.
Speaker 2:So I mean if they want to. I think people get you know it's. It's the old adage of like have your cake and eat it too. Like do you want it to be attempted? Do you do you want it to be attempted? Do you want it? Do you want them to attempt to make it as comic book accurate and possible as, and fail and not live?
Speaker 2:up to no, they didn't do this. This part right. Or this part right. Or do you want them to take a chance and remix it a little bit, make it their own thing and possibly flourish like I don't see what's necessarily wrong with that. I think some of my favorite stuff from the MCU is when they do take the lore. Think of the Ego and Star.
Speaker 1:Wars. Thing.
Speaker 2:It's a huge one, ego being Peter Quill's father, as opposed to how it goes down in the comics. I think that's one of the best emotional moments of the MCU is those scenes with Ego and Peter. It's one of the best emotional moments of the MCU is is you know those scenes with with ego and Peter, like when they do that stuff? I think it more often. More often than not it works. I mean sometimes it doesn't. I mean you could argue night and day that you know how they dealt with Ultron, and the MCU wasn't exactly you know the best, but I think the performance of Ultron was good. I think the writing behind Ultron was strong. It's just that they kind of just used him as this one-off.
Speaker 1:Avengers villain.
Speaker 2:But a lot of the stuff that they've done with the. They've truly created their own universe and they've created their own canon, which I think is really really hard to do. But as long as you stick to the rules of that canon, I don't think there's necessarily anything wrong with that um. So, like I said, I'm willing to give this such, not just willing to give this a chance. I think it's. I think it's gonna be good. Um, and people just questioning whether or not downey can do this without like, did you watch him in oppenheimer? He's, yeah, awful. Strass is an awful person right and down. He plays him with incredible conviction and it's exactly what he said.
Speaker 1:He said his power stays in the shed, like that's in secret wars or the lead-up to secret wars. Spoiler alert that's literally what doom is doing. The big reveal is that doom was the one that orchestrated this entire thing.
Speaker 1:So I think I think he's gonna be fine um or not orchestrated it, but he's the one that saved it, by his machinations, yeah, and by putting making sure like the man traveled back in time, created a cult to worship himself, so they would be powerful enough to back him by the time. By the time, it came pretty tough. That is one of the coolest things that a villain can do.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I think it's going to be fine. It's where I've landed. I think I've landed, that it's going to be fine. We do have some trailers, though Trailers to talk about. First and foremost, we got a Last of Us trailer. Everything looks better.
Speaker 1:Physically like.
Speaker 2:Everything looks better from season one.
Speaker 1:I mean, scale is something, but also intimacy is something as well too, and I mean relationship wise. It feels more dialed, like everybody feels like I think they understood the task that's at hand. Yeah, from a non.
Speaker 1:I think they understood the two ends of the, of the, of like, the two ends of the spear, of like, hey, hey, we need to just nail this. Like we're, you know, we made one of the best shows of 2023. Like we need to come back with absolute fire when we come back around to do this one more time. And it's not only that, understood, we're 2024. That showed the beginning of 2024, january. Like, we also understand of like the consummate pressure we have, pressure from just being a great show that needs to follow up with the second great season. They also know the pressure of the gaming community of what's going to happen.
Speaker 1:Those who know know those who do not are going to want to just hurl themselves off a bridge. Like this is how this is going to go. But again, again, no better person to put in that situation than Craig Mason. I mean somebody that's like a consummate, you know professional, somebody that's got full control over you know how to connect and how to structure and how to long form and how to like, really break down and really understand how to, how to craft. I think he's one of the best crafters, he's one of the best weavers there is and, like I said on a long-form front and going into this trailer, I mean we can talk about the coverage of what this is going to cover throughout the game without getting into too many spoilers. So I mean, you're looking at the Jackson stuff is the big stuff that this is going to cover? The Jackson stuff slash the Abbey stuff are the two big things. There's Seattle stuff in here.
Speaker 1:There's a lot of Seattle stuff. A lot of Seattle stuff, which brings me to my big theory. I need drum rolls or something when we get into the theory time. They're going to tell this non-linearly. They're going to do this, seems to be.
Speaker 2:That seems to be happening.
Speaker 1:They're going to do this. They're going to do everything in here, non-linear back and forth, because I think even some of like the leaked set photos, had abby and or had ellie and ellie and dina on the horse in seattle, like while it was summer in seattle, I believe. So that's pretty deep into that game. I think what they're going to do is season three is going to be santa clara and season two is going to be the whole second game, like season two will be, or the two-thirds of the second game, like it's going to be almost all of it. Season three is going to be santa clara and whatever they're going to add into it as well too. Um, whatever differences they're going to make, I have a feeling that again I'm gonna, I'm gonna say this until I'm proven otherwise, which maybe I should, but I just I'm being stubborn.
Speaker 1:I still think that HBO told you know, druckmann, you better get on the Last of Us Part III immediately, like immediately. This game needs to be done. Like I know you're working on your Intergalactic game. Get that game out, and the next year I need you to get the Last of Us Part III out, three out. So obviously that's a near impossibility, especially with intergalactic being this like absolute space epic, amazing 80s inspired space epic. It's about to be. However, I do think that they understand how fruitful this last of us universe is and how lucky that that, you know, warner brothers was the one to pick up the rights to it as well. So I think they understand. I think they said like, hey, we need this third story at least mapped out. But, like I said, I think season three is going to be Santa Clara and season two is going to be Jackson and Seattle, and then the killing blow up and then the thing is going to happen in the like that's going to be the cliffhanger. It's the thing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean that'd be such a wild way to tell that second game story, but it could also address a lot of the criticisms that I have had of the pacing of the second game. Um, if they do try and do it non-linearly and I think it also addresses some of the you know, not addresses the issues that, the questions that I have, but it addresses the thing that I've been saying for a while about how they need to handle abby. They need to handle her with a little bit of a sense of mystery and and build her up as as more of a protagonist, and I think telling the story non-linearly could do that. Um, especially as, as it appears that they're really gonna set up, they're not. I don't think they're making any bones about the WLF being an antagonistic faction or, at the very least, isaac being an antagonistic figure. The vibe that you get from Jeffrey Wright in these first couple trailers is that he is going to be outwardly villainous and I think that is how you make Abby a little less villainous, seeming.
Speaker 1:I don't. Maybe we saw Owen in that snapshot of when they're walking to the cabin. It seems like, but I don't know why, I keep getting this weird feeling they're purposely withholding who's playing Abby's father, like they're. They're purposely withholding it because I feel as if they possibly were able to get a bigger actor to play her father and, to our point, like if you were able, in some incredible way, shape or form, find a way to get this bigger actor, this lovable actor, and then the thing happens for him. And then it's like can we spoil that part? Is that a big deal?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean we can throw a spoiler, spoiler warning on top right. This is a big piece for it.
Speaker 1:So what you find out is that one of the doctors that joel kills is abby's father. That's why it's such a, that's why that revenge story is. You know, and I and I said it all the time one of my favorite parts about the last part two is perspective. Like once your perspective shifts, it's just that game just needs to do a better job at, you know, making abby into a character that you want to root for and then get there. But then you go right back to ellie again too and you're like wait actually I hate abby, and you don't want that, so yeah yeah, um, yeah, that's all I can say.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I don't know. Again, everything just looks better from the first season. They heard your complaints about the zombies. Don't freak out. No, they're infected.
Speaker 1:There's no zombies in that universe.
Speaker 2:There's going to be infected in droves this season. It appears.
Speaker 1:Yes, woof.
Speaker 2:So don't worry, and we're just going to get some more of the great character work that we got in the first season. I think you know what that show was really great with was expanding the universe, and I'm just looking forward to seeing how they do more of that in season two and beyond. Um, we got a andor trailer woof, um, woof.
Speaker 1:Yeah, this is gonna be good what a, what an absolutely incredible way for them to approach the trailer down to the music, and I mean the show is just looks so sharp. It's it shows sharply shot, um, and everybody's dialed in like this is the most. It's the most war we've ever seen in star wars. Yeah, and we've seen actual war in star wars. It's the most war because it's the. It's the byproduct of the bad, of what war is. It's. It's the truest form of the war in star wars. It's. It's not about these big, you know, deaths they're big death star a little bit but it's not about these, these you know it is ultimately about the death star, tie, fighter, x-wing battles or these you know lightsaber duels like it's about the political gain.
Speaker 1:It's about the Death Star, tie fighter, x-wing battles or these lightsaber duels. It's about the political gain, it's about the people. It's about the people. The people are the number one priority and I think that's why season one sings so harmoniously. It's such this realm of feel I felt the whole time Down to characters like Nemec, down to characters like what's her name? I forget her name.
Speaker 1:Mothma, yeah like looking at all these characters from this realm of like. Oh, it's actually about the people in here. Like gave me that feel of like you know what story. Like how you originally feel for Luke. And like gives me the same feel of how you feel when you're playing the Star Wars Jedi games. I actually care about these people that are just thrown into this eternal war that seems like it'll never end.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I mean I love we're going to talk about the Thunderbolts trailer in a second too but it is kind of hilarious that Disney is just like, hey, this is the cool thing that we made. They did the same thing with the Andor trailer when they were like this is the most well-written Star Wars thing ever and like, yeah, it might be. Um. So that's kind of funny that they're kind of like self-reflective on that front, being like, yeah, we know that this thing was well regarded for these reasons and we're going to give you more of that. You know, everything just looks incredible and just the way Tony Gilroy talks about this show just makes you like, yeah about this show just makes you like, yeah, just, it's just.
Speaker 2:I love when showrunners, especially like showrunners that like that, come with the gravitas of a tony gilroy yeah, and he's like just super jazzed for like everything that he's doing. Um, it's super cool, um, and you know, again, the best thing I can say about this show and the best thing I can say about both of us were when, before the show came out, you know we're both like all right, you know we're going to do this Cassian and or prequel thing, like cool, and then the show turned out to be incredible.
Speaker 1:Incredible is an understatement.
Speaker 2:And then you're like man, this just colors the way that I view Rogue One, and I'm looking forward to seeing how season two also does more of that, right, considering that season two is A the final season, and it's going to bleed directly into Rogue One and it's just going to enrich that movie. That was already great, yeah, and it's just going to enrich it even more now that we're going to have cassian's whole story, right, um. So I'm really really looking forward to that, um. And then the last trailer we have to talk about is the thunderbolts the absolute cinema trailer man, what a what a swing.
Speaker 2:It's a flex, it's a flex, it's a flex and it's a flex, it's a flex, it's a flex and it's a swing, man. And for them to just be just so unabashed about it.
Speaker 1:And I want the. I told you so because this is how I want the structure. This is how I'm thinking. I think Captain America Brave New World was the last of that very rough old guard way of looking at phase four and five. I think the Thunderbolts was the discernible start of like wait, should we do cinema? Remember, we joked about this weeks and weeks ago. We were like at what point is marvel gonna get catch on? And be like maybe we should try the cinema and like we're talking about, like you know, obviously for fantastic four they were testing the panavision cameras and like you look at the personnel and like it's funny.
Speaker 1:I didn't know who was working on the Thunderbolts. And then like obviously I knew that the beef director did this before they dropped this trailer. But you looked at the Thunderbolts trailer, you're like wait, why does this? It looks different, it feels different. And then you go into personnel and it all and it backs up my point it's not about the movie, it's about who you got movie. It's about who you got and I'm glad we're going to do this pitch meeting as well too. It's my favorite thing of the pitch meetings that we do. Um, a star wars pitch meeting would also be a fun episode too yeah, yeah, we're gonna have to do that, yeah um, but man, this team that they have on this film is absurd.
Speaker 1:I mean, you're getting the emmy award-winning director of beef. Um, who else are you getting? You're getting the editor of minari really incredible movie as well, too that lee isaac chung.
Speaker 2:Everything, everywhere, all at once what's their name?
Speaker 1:son lux or something like that? Um, the group's name. Um, you are getting. Who else are you getting on this? You're getting the beef director, you're getting the minari editor, you're you're getting the cinematographer of the green knight. Like, what an absolute team they put together. And again they really played on like what did? Uh, the day before florence, pew said like this is like if an a24 did a marvel movie and people were started losing their minds. They, they're like don't mention A24 and Marvel in the same. Relax, calm down. It's okay, it's fine.
Speaker 2:It's actually a great approach. I think so too. I think this is long, long overdue. But also now that you've put this out there.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:Right, you've put this out there. As Marvel, as Disney, you have to now fulfill that promise. Yes, you have to live up to this now which I think this movie will do.
Speaker 1:But it's not about this movie? Yeah, because I have a feeling that the thunderbolts and the fantastic four are gonna do both of those things, for both different, in the same reasons, like you've now you've now hung a lantern on this idea, that you've now openly admitted through this trailer, that, like we're actually trying to make a movie now, mm-hmm.
Speaker 1:And movies to come. Yeah, and like man, you know what movie I'm looking at right now the Eternals. Like I wish the Eternals would have came out after this movie, because then they would have been like no, let Chloe do whatever she wants. What are we even infringing on anything for? I think this movie they let them do a lot of what they wanted to do, like I don't think there was too much.
Speaker 1:I don't think there was much meddling in this movie. It feels like and I know like Paul Jenkins was a part of making this movie Like Marvel doesn't do that overtly too much DC does, I don't think marvel does that in crazy amount to have the creators of the things like I'm talking direct one-to-one, like consulting on these films. I could be wrong, but like this one, like paul jenkins said like no, I was like a big part of getting century in this movie and how the attack for century was yeah, I'm again like I said now you've, you've now hung a lantern on this idea that you're trying to make an actual movie.
Speaker 1:A film.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and now you have to fulfill that promise. Now, in a weird way, the Thunderbolts kind of had a low floor, high ceiling. Now I feel like the floor has dropped a little bit, because now this movie, fairly or unfairly, is going to come with a level of expectation now, Like you've now hung a lantern on. Look at all this cinema personnel we're putting behind this movie.
Speaker 1:This zany like fun like new.
Speaker 2:Now you have to deliver, like now this movie is now positioned. Not to be kind of like this fun surprise, now this movie comes in with a level of expectation position. Not to be kind of like this fun surprise, now this movie comes in with a level of expectation. Um, but I will say, for them to market it this way speaks to what I believe was a lot of confidence. I don't think they would have done the trailer like this if they weren't very, very confident.
Speaker 1:I think they knew. I think when they started the pre-screenings, I think they knew that they were like wait, because again, I think that with the Thunderbolts to your point about the floor right being kind of like it's close to the ceiling, like it is what it is I think that Kevin Feige is like you guys do what you got to do, like I'm not, I'm worried about the fantastic four, like you guys do what you got to do. And they were like really, I can get whoever I want. Like the beef director's, like I can get whoever I want for this.
Speaker 1:And he went through his a24 rolodex and he got everybody that ever worked on an a24 movie, including half of these actors in this movie. So he's like wait, I can do whatever I want. Yeah, it was like sure, we got the fit. Like I'm worried about, I'm worried about you know bigger things down the line. Do what you got to do. And I'm like thank god, like again, yeah, the one that really is glaring to me that I wish would have came out after this whole initiative, to be like, hey, we should have done cinema. And I'm like, yeah, I tried to tell you guys was the eternals. Like that's the biggest one I wish would have been on the other half of this.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so yeah, I mean, like I said, I think this movie can't imagine a world that they would put out a trailer like this if they weren't supremely confident that the thing that they're now advertising, that they've made, or that they're, I guess, insinuating that they've made, like you don't put out a trailer like this and you're like, unless you're like, yeah, we made an actual film here, you know, an action film, but a film nonetheless, unless you were supremely confident that that's the type of movie that you've done. So we'll see. I mean, this movie comes out in a couple months and I think we both, after that first initial trailer, are both like oh yeah, this could be really, really special. So I'm really looking forward to it. Yep, so on that front, um, let's do, let's do pitch meeting. Yeah, because it's about the personnel.
Speaker 1:It's about the personnel, so yeah um dc pitch meeting, much like the marvel pitch meeting. We're going into the office, we have our business suits on, we have our briefcases with not with comics in them. James gunn is here. Yeah, james gunn's here. He's got his laptop. He's got his glasses. James Gunn is here. Yeah, james Gunn's here. He's got his laptop. He's got his glasses. Nathan Fillion is here for some reason yeah, for some odd reason. Dave Bautista's here. I still am very excited and a little scared. Who's the funniest fourth person that can be in here? John Cena, john.
Speaker 2:Cena's in here.
Speaker 1:John Cena's in here. So same approach you get a film, you get a TV show, you get a special presentation, and then I will give you a fourth cook project.
Speaker 2:Just cook. I wasn't ready for that one. All right, I can freestyle it. I think I went first last time, so you can go first this time.
Speaker 1:I think I'd like you to go first again. You get the number one pick two years in a row. What? I think I went first last time, so you can go first this time. I think I'd like you to go first again. Oh, you get the number one pick two years in a row.
Speaker 2:What are we?
Speaker 1:doing. First. Let's go the progression so we can start. I feel like last time the special presentation meant so much to us. It kind of divulged into the one that we ended up having so much passion. My show is the one that I have the most passion for.
Speaker 2:Let's start with the special presentation okay, uh, that's the one I gave the least amount of thought to. Funny enough, um, special presentation. You know what I'm, you know what I need. I'm gonna need to think about it, so I'm gonna, I'm gonna do my tv show first, because it's the one that I'm most realized about, and you know, you know me from the last one, I'm a big continuation reboot guy. Um, and this is something that has been out in the ether, um, for quite a while, that I, you know, I'm not sure will ever happen, and it's a, it's an hbo revival of arrow uh, okay, so you weren't joking when you talked about the different approach you were going to take.
Speaker 1:You were not joking.
Speaker 2:Okay. I think it makes a ton of sense. I think that you have a character that is ripe for this type of thing. I wouldn't complicate it too much. I'm probably just bringing James Bamford back, who, I believe, directed the most episodes of Arrow Okay, from 2015 to 2020. And he directed the finale, if I'm not mistaken. He's a former stunt guy, grew up in the stunt business, much like what's his name, david Leitch Yep, who, if I was making an Arrow reboot movie, I would probably do David Leitch, I think he's got a good hand.
Speaker 2:That's really good, but I don't think David Leitch would do an Arrow miniseries. No, so I'd probably just get James Bamford back to do a kind of. I guess I'd probably do 8 episodes, maybe 18 episodes 18 episodes though, and I would probably just play the hits. Um, maybe set it not quite kind of like a, almost like a daredevil adjacent type thing, where it's kind of like is this the same universe, is this a reboot, is this something else? Um, and just play the hits. Um, I would play the hits, I would surround it around, probably do I.
Speaker 2:Probably, just again, I'd probably just play the hits and probably just do some type of oliver deathstroke story. Um, make it a little bit more less, a little less cable tv, a little more focused. Um, I probably, maybe you know what, maybe what I do, and I do, um, kind of like a remix of the arrow prison arc, but make it a little more kind of like fan servicey where, like I put a you know you build the first episode oliver's in prison, you don't know why, um, and you kind of unravel that mystery, okay, as things go along, but like in the prison he's dealing with you know who's who of like arrow villains I like that.
Speaker 1:I like an approach of like this super max prison with all, like your play, hits villains and then, yeah, why is oliver also in this?
Speaker 2:you just bring them all back like malcolm merlin's there, you put freaking. You put bronze tiger there. I love the bronze tiger bit in arrow when he's in prison. There, you put freaking, you put bronze tiger there. I love the bronze tiger bit in arrow when he's in prison. There, you put bronze tiger in there. Well, you put prometheus in there, um, and you just build it around this whole thing. And then you find out again, because it's kind of like remixed arrow lore, you find out like deathstroke's the one that kind of like orchestrated him being put in prison, because like that's how else you get him off the street. Right, likestroke's the one that orchestrated him being put in prison, because that's how else you get him off the street. What's the biggest way to kick Oliver Queen when he's down? You frame him for a crime and you put him in jail. Obviously, you bring Manu Bennett back.
Speaker 2:Yep, that's your biggest get back, honestly, that's your biggest, get back and then obviously your final episode is as great as the. I do enjoy the deathstroke arrow stuff in season two, like that final fight that they have where they're constantly flashing back, back and forth. But I think you just end this mini series with like a proper, just r-rated deathstroke versus green arrow fight, kind of like in the vein of like I'm thinking of, like remember, like batman arkham origins, where they do like the deathstroke cut scene, like I'm thinking that, but like a green arrow, like they start, kind of maybe they both start like a distance, sure, and they're both like you know, you got oliver out of prison. Probably he gets out like probably like episode five, four or five, gets his, gets his suit back, finds out that slade is the one that orchestrated his imprisonment.
Speaker 2:For I would have to I didn't quite think about like the crime, probably like a murder, a murder of some sort that he was framed for. Um, probably a murder of like maybe it's like a murder of like a john diggle, oh. And then we just keep it really tight. We don't really connect it to any type of greater DC lore or anything like that. You just make it very self-contained and just good action In my brain.
Speaker 2:You kind of treat the prison like a scott pilgrim type deal like every episode like like he's working his way like through the present prison because, like, obviously the guards are in on it, so they're like oh right shoot, damn oliver, it's crazy that you ran into malcolm merlin in this hall right now.
Speaker 2:We have to have a fight right, like maybe he teams up with like a villain in there. I don't know who he would team up with, maybe a sister? Oh, like the half-sister, oh yeah, oh yeah, that's a way to bring her back. You have them kind of team up in the prison and they get after it. Maybe throw some of the flashback villain guys in there. That'd be fun. Yeah, yeah, like I said, I think you play the hits. You treat it as like an eight episode, like love letter to this show that we've talked about before was like the, the true linchpin kickstarter of like shared cinematic universes. That doesn't get nearly enough credit. Um, right, and then maybe at the end of the end episodes you throw a little Flash cameo in there.
Speaker 1:That'd be fun. That'd be fun. Joe West cameo Sure Gratuitous cameos. Oh, there would be definitely gratuitous cameos.
Speaker 2:Oh my gosh.
Speaker 1:This actually only thrives off gratuitous cameos.
Speaker 2:And then you have like maybe the, maybe the way he like gets out of prison is like you have the separate story arc where, like it's quentin and laurel because like again separate universe type deal, quentin and laurel are like working on the outside trying to figure out how he, what happened, right, and then like they have the big like come to moment where, like they get him out and then quentin and laurel like sit all over down, they're like no, actually like deathstroke is the one that's like orchestrating this, and then they, they come to blows so an arrow revival, revival, one season.
Speaker 1:Yeah, let's put them.
Speaker 2:Put them in the thunderdome yeah, yeah, yep, steven amell is obviously coming back duhuh yeah. I mean that's.
Speaker 1:Stephen Amell, that's Stephen's the Amell.
Speaker 2:The Salmon Ladder is back. He gets Big, big montage, big training montage In episode four or five. Whenever he decides to get out of prison, he gets back to the. We bring it back, we remix it. We bring it back to like the old school Under the foundry Right Bunker Instead of like the big technological Thing. Old school under the foundry bunker instead of like the big technological thing. And he gets the salmon ladder, he gets in there. The voiceover's back no, I'm kidding. Maybe, actually, maybe I'm not kidding Maybe we do do a voiceover, a monologue. No, no, maybe.
Speaker 1:No, you have to. What are you talking about? That's one of the most core pieces of this whole thing.
Speaker 2:The man in the hood was there that night, damn. And then you bring back what's his name? Blake Neely, the score guy.
Speaker 1:You have to. All-time score yeah it's pretty good, insane. All right, you go, am I?
Speaker 2:going with my TV show.
Speaker 1:You can go whatever you want, because you told me to do the special thing and I wasn't ready for it, so I just changed, I changed your. Well, I'll do my tv show then, so so we can keep keep volleying back and forth. So this is the one that means the most to me. I've talked about it on here, about this, a bunch of times. Um, it's the mr miracle show.
Speaker 1:I think that is one of the simply one of the most special comic book runs there's ever been. I mean, the themes that they tackle in that is absolutely insane. It is. It's one of those, it's one of those books where it kind of changes you a bit after you read it. And like it's always my point of like it doesn't matter where the media is consumed from, as long as the story is great and impactful. And Mr Miracle is a great example of that. The Last of Us video game is a great example of that. The last of us video game is a great example of that. Like it doesn't matter that it's a comic book in a video game, like the story that comes from that is absolutely exceptional and absolutely top tier.
Speaker 1:And I mean that mr miracle run, you know, dealing with all the mental illness that they were talking about in that, I mean, you know you're talking about a character that's entire power set is built upon escaping from anything and you know the first panel like that's in, like the present day in that book is him, you know, trying to take his own life. Like that is a potent way to start a book, and I mean encapsulated on max would be the best place to capture all this. Like this, you know r-rated, you know super, like, super emotional, but kind of also very like zany and weird kind of television show. Um, my personnel that I need for this, dylan o'brien, is that's mr miracle, like the look he had an american assassin and like that, that one frame of him just looking directly at the camera when he's, when he's in that, in that, like that's mr miracle. Like there's this broken nature that gets added on to it as well too, and kind of like this, like weight that gets added on to mr miracle. And I I just find that you know it would be so fun to attack like I love like the whole approach of mr miracle, how regular everything is like. If paul rudd was younger he would also be a perfect Mr Miracle. I love this whole idea that his wife's and obviously because I needed to grab the tallest actress I could Elizabeth Debicki would be Big Barda. That's easily the easiest casting that I would have to go through, but I just think it would be absolutely incredible.
Speaker 1:Imagine you're doing your show, like it feels a bit like something just feels off that's the big thing for the Mr Miracle book, like and again, that's a big, you know allegory for mental illness Like something just feels off, this whole thing, like there's this ever present loom that's over you and I mean I love the thing, the situation he gets thrown into. It's like his wife's having a bit. It's a satire piece, um, which is gonna get me into like I'm having a battle of who I want to direct this. But I think I kind of just answered my question. I had a battle of the approach I wanted to take. But I just feel like it would be absolutely hilarious if, like you know, he's like you know, like his wife's having you know their, their kid, and like the furies are in the room over of, like you know, tomorrow we're gonna like try to murder you, right, they're like can we just let my son be born today? And like dark side is like eating a baby carrot at his son's baby shit, like it's the most weird and absurd. But it's also high, violently emotional and violently topical and violently potent of a story. Um, it's one of the most special ones that you can find. So obviously, like I said, dylan O'Brien and Elizabeth Debicki would lead this, as Scott Free and Big Barda, my writer, would be. It's a combination team. Obviously Tom King. It would be Tom King, but I want Tom King and I want Cord Jefferson, who worked on American Fiction, won the Oscar for American Fiction, but for your DC fans know that he wrote one of the only Emmy Award winning episodes of the Watchmen, like the Watchmen TV show. Cord Jefferson won the Oscar for that episode. So I really think that their tandem together, as an approach to how to really break down a character, I think they do really well and strip down like this superhero mystique around it as well too. I think that both of them do an absolute incredible job at that as well too.
Speaker 1:Um so, my director, I had a battle and I think I answered my question. At first, I had koganata, who did after yang and, more important, like more famously, he did columbus, and I think I think it's because there was an ambience about the way that he directs that I wanted. But you know who would be absolutely perfect to get the weirdness out of this, the satire out of this Because this does need to be a part satire piece it's Bill Hader. Bill Hader would be the absolute perfect person to direct this thing. He would capture the weirdness and the absurdities. And again, it's the same thing that the bear happened to and like these more and again it's the same thing that the bear happened to, same thing that ted lasso happens to, same thing, obviously, barry happened to.
Speaker 1:The first seasons of comedy. The deeper you get, you're like why am I always sad when I watch this show? And that's what I want to attack like I really want to get into that realm. So, uh, like I said, I think dylan o'brien would be the absolute number one and perfect choice. And it's also like one of those things like, obviously, when teen wolf was coming out more like, more specifically, when the maze runner was coming out, like I thought dylan o'brien was like next, like I thought he was gonna be the absolute biggest star. Obviously, he had a very violent like. He had a very, very bad injury that he suffered as well too, on the maze runner, which kind of derailed some things. But he's still in his mid-30s I think early to mid-30s so obviously, like he is, he's still primed for an absolutely incredible career and I think I think a role like this would really kind of like propel him back into that a-list stratosphere of like everybody's wants to know what he's doing as well too.
Speaker 1:So, um, I had my cinematographer as the loki cinematographer and the black panther cinematographer, autumn Durald-Archipel. I feel like the way that she captures shadows and lights and the way they were approaching Loki, I kind of want that same look for something like this. And then my composer same thing. The Loki composer would be Natalie Holt. That one I had a lot of thought into.
Speaker 2:I can tell, I can tell you really thought into.
Speaker 1:I can tell that's great, and if Bill Hader's not around to direct, I'll do it glad you're willing to step up. I hope you did the same thing on a writing front for one of these. I'll just do it.
Speaker 2:I'll do it myself, I'll do it myself my special feature one I wouldn't mind writing because it feels like it'd be fun, so I guess I could just jump into that sure, I'm actually very excited to talk about that one.
Speaker 1:I took a different approach and my special presentation is going to be a series of special presentations that are going to culminate in a fourth piece. You can do that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, this is our show this guy's making his own rules. I am making my own rules. I'm kind of making my own not making my own rules per se, but my idea for a special presentation would be a Booster Gold Blue Beetle thing nice, nice, nice, nice, nice, nice. Yeah, so instead of, but instead of doing Ted Kord and Booster, Gold, you're a genius.
Speaker 2:I'm going to do Jaime Reyes and Booster Gold, in which Booster Gold comes back in time to get Blue Beetle and he ends up running into the Jaime Reyes variant Not variant, but the Jaime Reyes Blue Beetle and he's like, oh no, I got stuck with another Blue Beetle. So obviously I just bring Zola Maradona back as Jaime Reyes. I don't think you'd get much better casting than that. As for my Booster Gold actor, I would like to nominate Patrick Schwarzenegger. I think that's really good, I think that's really really good.
Speaker 2:I think that guy was great in the Boys as Golden Boy when he was in it for a bit. I think he would be great as a Booster Gold and their dynamic would be more kind of like one of just it's just kind of like wackiness.
Speaker 1:It's like if Star-Lord were to be like your mentor figure. Like yeah, you need to be taught things. Like why are you talking to me as if I need to learn things?
Speaker 2:Yeah, like it's weird, like it'd be this dynamic where, like Blue Beetle, like Jaime Reyes, is kind of like entering his own as like a superhero, and booster gold's like man. This is not what I was expecting, right. Um, as who the villain would be, I would have to go with booster gold's father, john Carter. Oh, that's good, played by.
Speaker 1:Anthony star. Oh, that's really good, that's really good, that's good, I like that. I like that quite a bit.
Speaker 2:And that's why Booster Gold has come back through time, because he's trying to figure out how to beat up his dad.
Speaker 1:I will say, to give a bit of a leak for one of mine, this is not the last time you're going to be hearing from Anthony Starr tonight. Oh, wonderful.
Speaker 2:I just feel like that would be a kind of neat sim, like synthesis of like the boys universe where like golden boy was like supposed to be the next homelander, right and then you have anthony star playing kind of like an evil not an evil version of booster gold, but like this kind of like father figure who's you get?
Speaker 2:you get anthony star to play like the character, that kind of like soldier boy was the homelander, like, ah, he looks at booster gold and he's like you're a disappointment. You know that like you're like the worst ever. Um, and then, like you can, you can do a whole bunch of stuff. You can interject the Mr Mind stuff into. That's the reason why John Carter is the worst, right, and you can bring back our old pal Mr Mind. No, don't do it.
Speaker 1:You know what Actually. Do it. Why not? It's actually fine, you can bring it back.
Speaker 2:As for who I would want to direct this, I was quite fond of the. I think I would probably just get the Blue Beetle director in Angel Manuel Soto.
Speaker 1:Um, I think Blue Beetle, much like he was in his own film, would be kind of like the grounding mechanism and the heart just get a nice little team up movie not a movie but, like you know, special presentation you tell that story in like an hour and a half.
Speaker 2:That's still a film yeah and, like you know, they just start, like he just starts, like he's blue beetling and then all of a sudden, boom booster, gold shows up and he's like oh, he's like ted.
Speaker 1:You're not the.
Speaker 2:Blue Beetle I'm looking for, you're not Ted. And then we keep up this hilarious bit of Ted Kord just not appearing in anything ever, which is an excellent byproduct of this. It's kind of funny, I'm not gonna lie. He's mentioned in name, only we hear him speak a little bit in Blue Beetle at the end, and I just think that would be fun. So that's, that's mine.
Speaker 1:Okay, I love it, I really like it I'm a big fan, thanks I'm an absolute big fan. All right, I put a lot of thought into this. Yeah, you got four concurrent spinoff things.
Speaker 1:Yes, so this is kind of like a special presentation, like it's a mini series at this point yeah, like it's a, it's a mini series, it's like this and you're doing black mirror, but dc a little bit. I think it's like this, like. So here's my approach. So, obviously, paul dini and the absolutely like monumentous alex ross made the, those, those series of books. So it's, you know, batman, war on crime, superman, peace on earth, so on and so forth. So you do those two and you do the wonder woman one as well too. Um, I forget what her, the name of hers is, but you do those three. So you start with the wonder woman one, you do the bat, you do the superman one, you end on the batman one. But what you do, what you do, is you find a way to tie them back into jim krueger's justice, also drawn by alex ross.
Speaker 1:Because what you do is you weave those three together to kind of get the you know the behind the scenes kind of you know string pulling of the Injustice League, and then you weave that into like essentially like a like a mini series version of, like this, this Justice League story, like, like I said, justice by Jim Kruger. I think it's an incredible book, all four of those books are incredible books, but you find a way to kind of weave those together too. So, like, my approach that I wanted for this was I wanted it to be like this almost like you know, know, narration was a big thing. I, in my opinion, like I needed the narration to be this piece that was so, like, so prominent. And you know, I want the it's perspective, I want the perspective of them.
Speaker 1:And then how essentially you approach it. You kind of take the trinity book that they did, the three of them, and you, you kind of use that as the base for justice. You kind of weave those two books together as the fourth part, like the penalty, like the final part, um, so you do the justice storyline. So you know, what I really want to capture is like the different thought processes behind, you know, the leaders of the justice league I, and also the reason why I kind of picked those is I was.
Speaker 1:I was Alex Ross when I was thinking about it and like his classic it's almost like classical music, his classical approach to everything and the way he kind of thinks about everything too. So for my personnel, on this film, craig Mazin would write it. I feel like he would be the best version of a person that can really understand this. How to weave things, like I talked about earlier, he's one of the best weavers you can find. Like to play off all these stories is going to be very difficult to tie back into the fourth part, and the fourth part can be a film if you want to end it on a fourth like, the fourth part being a film after three special presentations. But these like three things that the biggest pieces of them is their character studies. I want three back-to-back-to-back character studies and the fourth one be like why all these need to be important to each other and why these are the three leaders of the justice league for all different reasons. And you know I want to go through all the trials and tribulations of the justice book of, like you know, superman gets sent shazam to take care of him and then you know, one of the best parts of that book is Cheetah infects Wonder Woman with the centaur blood and she's like Wonder Woman's like I'm actually dying this time I don't really like it, but I'm not going out without swinging. It's the systematic unfolding of the Justice League, is what Justice kind of takes on. So it's a really good book and I really kind of want to see that. I want to see a lex luther kind of be the main villain of this entire thing of, or the entire, just like joker. You know, joker, lex luther, cheetah like, and then you get into the green lantern stuff like green lantern literally gets thrown on the other side of space with like no direction of his ring where he needs to go and he needs to get back onto the other side of the universe. Like Shazam being infected and working for Lex Luthor, like I want all of the oh sorry, that's in, that's in, that's my mistake, that's in, that's in Kingdom Come, right, no, no, no, that's in Justice. That's not in Justice, that's in the book Justice by Jim Kruger and Alex Ross.
Speaker 1:So I was, but I just I really wanted, I was going to do a three-parter, but I thought they should culminate in something and I think justice is the best way to culminate the three of those, three of those pieces. But, like I said, I want three character studies on why all their ideologies on the way that they deal with their cities or deal with the world is all three different but still it's like different but the same. They still want the same things out of each other. So I feel like that would be a really good approach to do, to kind of do it's like the alex ross, like triumphant, like here, like this is what you've worked all your life for is to you know, have your name on all these projects.
Speaker 1:So, um, for my composer, the feel I want a classical feel to this, and not only in the way and my cinematographer is also going to make sense for this as well too I wanted this classical feel to it.
Speaker 1:So I said Michael Giacchino would be my composer, and then I said Emmanuel Lubezki, who did movies like La La Land. I want a bit of like a older feel to it. Like I want an older, more mature feel to it and I think the two of them combined with my director, who would be James Gray and I specifically took that from ad Astra, cause I'd love the way you shot ad Astra, but it's the approach of like it's that narration and it's so personal, like you're talking about this entire large scale conspiracy that's going on with the earth, but it's encapsulated in like a father and son story, like I want that approach for all these three characters of like whatever's going on and that's the long form weaving that Craig Mason would get after as well too. So that would be my approach. Like this four part mini series, like I said, maybe three special presentations that lead into a justice league. I love it. But, yeah, like a little bit mature, a little bit more classical feeling, but I really want this to be a celebration of the DC Trinity.
Speaker 2:I think that's a great idea and I think it's something that's kind of been a little disjointed at various points of what DC is doing currently, Like it feels like they can't quite hit all three of them at the same time and it's funny because Marvel did that and it all culminated in them walking up to Thanos in Endgame.
Speaker 1:Like the three of them together, like you felt each, every single individual of those three like why they are there at that moment in space and time. So I want that same approach, but I want it to kind of be, like I said, the celebration of the DC Trinity, of like why all their ideologies work, for what they're trying to do on Earth. And, like you know, obviously Batman's is different, like Batman's is a really emotional one, like superman's is like this you know forward thinking. And then you know all these pieces like I want all those three pieces to culminate into, like this justice league movie of like, like I said, like the injustice is, like league is literally systematically taking out all the justice league and like they look to those three of like what do we do? Like you guys are our leaders, what do we do? Like I really want to, really want to book, or sorry, I really want to like a live action version of like this is the celebration of not only that but DC Comics as a whole yeah, I really like that.
Speaker 2:I think that's really cool. I think your idea of like making it, I think, yeah, I think the idea of making it like kind of like a miniseries is actually really inspired Because, like you said, it kind of gives each story a purpose and then you culminate it in this other and I was really trying to think of what book I wanted this to culminate in.
Speaker 1:Like I could have went different directions, Like I could have taken a Justice League title I could have taken, could have taken a justice league title I could have taken, like you know, a justice league versus dark side title I could have taken, but like I think I wanted to stick with alex ross and sure I can't use something alex ross related. Yet it's coming, oh, but I like I said justice by jim kruger, I think is like it's very like it's like the top gun, maverick way of thinking. It's simple. Like it's like the book is literally the justice league versus the injustice league. That's all that book is, but it's the way they approach it.
Speaker 1:I think that would be and, like I said, like it is the celebration piece, like that of like it's all the best heroes versus all the best villains and like let's get it on. Like this is this, is it? Like I do want that big splash page, but like I also want it to be handled as like this, like remembrance piece of like you know why these characters are who they are, and like why the three of them are so important to like of all these all-powerful heroes Like, why are these three the ones that are, like, tasked with being the leaders of this entire thing?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think that's really great. I love the focus on the ideology part of it too, about what brings them together, but also what makes them different. I think it's really really smart. Yep, I love that Movie time, movie time, movie time.
Speaker 1:All right, this one I gave quite a bit of thought to.
Speaker 2:Me too one. I gave quite a bit of thought to me too. Um, so I thought back, thought long and hard about this and I'm just thinking to myself self what just great. You know, I love a good story about just a tortured soul doing. Doing a revenge mission is basically not a revenge mission per se, but, like I'm thinking, because, you know, one of the things we didn't really talk about up top was was that Jon Bernthal is doing a Punisher short special presentation thing. So I'm thinking like what, what DC version of like a Punisher story could I do? And I landed on the Red Hood, right, wow, ok. So I'm jumping right into Red Hood because I don't quite know what.
Speaker 2:I didn didn't want to jump through the logistics of well, what Batman is this Red Hood doing? I don't care, I'm not really pressed about the Batman thing. I'm more pressed about the story about this kid, young man who was left for dead and re-arose as just you know, this maniac. So, as far as directing goes, I'm pulling, I'm pulling the old man out of retirement or semi-retirement. I'm calling up John Woo, okay, and I'm like give me your kind of Hong Kong flair to this Red Hood movie. And you're like well. John Woo doesn't really know anything about superheroes. Well, he does. He is the co-creator of Seven Brothers, published by Virgin Comics. He's a comics guy, but to help him out with the writing, I would employ someone who both knows action very well and is familiar with the confines of a comic cinematic universe, and Shane Black would write it.
Speaker 1:Yo, what's this guy on? To Wait? This was me literally sitting forward in the chair. I was like wait a second, I'm in Hold on. So, Shane.
Speaker 2:Black writing John Woo directing this just kind of crime, woo directing this crime revenge story of the Red Hood going after. Take your pick of criminal. Obviously it's Black Mask. Obviously we're going to take Ewan McGregor and we're going to tone him down a smidge and make him a little more formidable. Okay, as a black mask. Um, and as for whom? I read hood. I thought a lot about this and I'm like do I want, how young do I want him to be? Do I want him to be like? You know? I thought like dacre montgomery, but I'm like maybe he's a little too old. So I landed on, you know, my blue beetle thing really got me thinking about Cobra Kai, and Tanner Buchanan is who came to mind to play a kind of not quite young kid, jason Todd, but a post, being beaten to death and coming back as, like this darker, grittier, angrier person. And Tanner Buchanan as my choice for Red Hood. And we just go like it's like John Wick meets Lethal Weapon, in a way.
Speaker 2:And we just create this again. We kind of like do DC's. This is what essentially would be like DC's version of the Punisher, where you sit down, you watch this movie for maybe not even two hours and you just leave the theater thinking, damn, that guy is cool. Is he cool? Yeah, hell, yeah, he's cool. He's Red Hood yo. And you draw that line at the very end of the movie.
Speaker 2:He's not a hero and he just probably just executes Black Mask at the end of it, and then maybe we can figure out the batman stuff afterwards okay I'm like should they do it how they're doing the ballerino, where, like he's just in the movie, like don't mince it, like just put him in the movie yeah, and then like maybe that's the big reveal, like he executes black mask, and then you get like a post-credit scene of like the batman showing up at like the crime scene and like you see, like one of those he's got like a red hood version of batarangs I don't know what they're called, but like maybe he like left one behind and batman just picks it up and like puts it up in the light and you're like oh, oh, like now batman's gotta.
Speaker 2:And then, like you could literally do like the next movie, like because like that would be the thing, like I would start. You start the movie like cold open of the movie and like you don't see anything, like you just hear jason todd being beaten to death and like the first and it's very uncomfortable, they would never do that like the first, like five minutes of the movie of is just him being beaten to death and you're like, oh god, like this is terrible. You hear like a you do maybe because like I still think mark hamill has like the best joker laugh, sure. So you do like a stock, stock audio of like mark hamill laugh laughing as like jason todd's like being beaten to death. And then, like we do, like because the john woo movie.
Speaker 1:So I think it's like a gun food type, you know, almost like a you know kind of not cheesy action movie, but like it's a John Woo movie so I think it's like a gun-fu type, you know almost like a you know kind of not cheesy action movie, but like it's like this hardcore action movie.
Speaker 2:It's like maybe we do like a little Jason Todd voiceover of like what happened to him and then you just see, you know, you just see Red Hood properly, like you don't see any of the beating stuff happening, and then the first thing you see is like the mask of like the Red Hood, and then you're like, oh, here we go, and like he's not, because like that's the whole thing, like you would think, like his revenge would want to be on Joker, but like that's never been that dynamic.
Speaker 1:No, no, no, no no.
Speaker 2:Historically. Like sure, red Hood is the means to an end for Joker. Like he doesn't really care about Jason Todd in that way. Like he beat Jason Todd to death just to get to Batman. So like they don't really have. Like they have beef, but it's like one-sided beef. You know, and then, like you just chronicle Red Hood like going after Black Mask, and he just just he keeps slipping through his fingers and then he finally, he finally gets him. And you're like what's he gonna do, like is he gonna kill him?
Speaker 1:and then he does I'm like, yeah, I would like that, I would like that too. And then again, you made a good point about like, just make them cool, just make them cool, just make a cool movie and you know the approach you're taking as well too of like you know, just punish your approach. Like you said, you thought about this special special presentation and like, why not translate that into a feature-length too? Of like you know, just punish your approach. Like you said, you thought about this special presentation and like, why not translate that into a feature length film? Of like this character in the Batman mythos that really needs some help in live action. I think that would be really cool.
Speaker 2:So and what you do to like emotionally ground the movie is you have him in these quieter moments with the mask off and like maybe there's flashbacks to like and again, like you don't show Batman really like and that's kind of the point, like artistically, like Jason Todd always felt secondary to, like Dick Grayson and you know, you you kind of play with that in the visual storytelling where, like, you never properly see Batman in any of these flashbacks because, like that's how Jason Todd viewed his relationship with Batman as like this distant thing that eventually blossomed not even blossomed blossoms the wrong way Like it eventually culminated in him being taken by the Joker and beaten to death.
Speaker 2:Um, and I mean, if, honestly, if you wanted to not do the supernatural aspect of his resurrection, you can literally just make it that Joker beat him to literally a millimeter of his life and he survived. You know what I mean, Right, and you just do it that way. If you want to take out the supernatural elements of the resurrection of Jason Todd, you just have it. So Joker beat him to an unrecognizable degree and then just left him or like dumped him in front of Wayne Manor or something like that.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And like left him in the, you know, maybe not Wayne Manor, Cause that wouldn't no, no, no, it wouldn't allow him to be.
Speaker 1:Just leave them, you, just leave them out. And then he just leaves, taken in by somebody, nursed back to health, and Batman just can't track him down for whatever reason, and then he just appears back. Yeah, as the.
Speaker 2:Red Hood Right and he, just like I said, just goes. I thought about who I and Black Mask felt like the most disposable. I wouldn't have him go up against the Penguin Sure or anything like that, and I wouldn't want him to go up against any of the super-powered bat criminals like Bane or Mr Freeze or anything like that. It would have to just be a mobster that has very little redeeming quality. If he was executed at the end of the movie, he'd be like he deserved it.
Speaker 2:Maybe you have Jason reconcile. Is he going to torture Black Mask the way the Joker tortured him? Sure, and then he just kind of gives him a bullet to the head and just puts him down. Yeah, big gasp, big gasp in the rain. It's raining for some reason, but I think the legendary John Woo would be my dream director for a movie like that.
Speaker 1:Okay, yeah, I'm in. I had to take a deep breath before I talked about mine.
Speaker 2:Yeah, let's hear it, I had to take a big old deep breath. Let's hear it.
Speaker 1:So this would be like as if they did Crisis on Infinite Earths or Final Crisis, and then this is like the post-mortem. This is the last one movie, if this makes sense. Obviously, I'm doing Kingdom Come as my film.
Speaker 2:I was waiting for this.
Speaker 1:To do Kingdom Come it. Only this garners the most grandiose approach that you were going to take. I feel like this story is so special that you need to approach it like that. So here is my pitch meeting. This is the one that I obviously personally the Mr Miracle one and like cynical not cynical like you know me up himself is like that's the one I can make one day, mr Miracle, if I work hard enough. If I work hard enough, mr Shop Owner man, I can own this shop one day. That's how I think about it. This Kingdom Come one, I feel like, would be one of the coolest ones. You want to talk about homage and payback and what these characters mean. This would be one of the coolest ones you can approach. This is my approach.
Speaker 2:I'm very excited to hear about this. I also thought a lot about this one.
Speaker 1:Here's my actors. I'll start with my actors. Josh Brolin would play the older version of Bruce Wayne in this.
Speaker 2:Interesting, so you're not legacy casting this. No, no, no.
Speaker 1:This is why I find this funny. Your whole approach was like these are the projects I think would be cool. Mine was like I need to fit this into the dcu, yeah, and let me work around fitting. So, just really quick, on my um, on my special presentation, it would be david corn's, what would be superman like. Yeah, yeah, um, adriana jorna, I want her to play wonder woman. She would be wonder woman.
Speaker 1:And then I'm not fighting the tidal wave that feels like it's coming for Brandon Slater to play Batman. It feels like he's the one that's being teed up to the point where he was in that interview like oddly suspicious a few weeks ago. Whatever premiere he was at, he was oddly specific, suspicious about getting asked about Batman. Like he was like to the point it's like when you know you have the job and like you don't want to say it, but like that's how it felt for him.
Speaker 1:I don't know why I might have wrote it right into that a little too much, but instead of using brandon sklaner because wonder woman and superman don't really age the same way, but batman does, I think josh brolin as like and you know the way that that suit, that batman is in kingdom come like he's over it, like I'm over it. Like I got my city on autopilot at this point. Like I'm I'm sick of this man, like I'm sick and tired of this and you're gonna make me come out of retirement for this. This is, this is an absolute joke and I hate you all. Like I feel like brolin encapsulates that the best out of anybody. So I want brolin to be this older batman, the mech Send the physicality for it.
Speaker 1:Yes, that's my piece. He has the past prime physicality for it. He's in the mech suit, he grunts when he has the move. He's just old and gray and angry. I like this. Obviously, you keep Adrienne Adjorna as Wonder Woman the same Wonder Woman because she won't age, so it's just her.
Speaker 2:Kyle Chandler. You keep him as green lantern.
Speaker 1:Keep kyle chandler's green lantern. Same thing, yep. Um, you maybe got to throw some extra gray on top of the gray, but you keep kyle chandler as the older green lantern. Let him, let him survive. Um, obviously, david corn sweat leads this. He plays superman, this older version of superman, which I think he would be absolutely incredible at this.
Speaker 1:Now I had a approach where I wasn't thinking about fitting this into the dcu. Tyler hecklund would have played my older superman and within a heartbeat, yeah, um, yeah. And I also was gonna get I forget her name that was in that wonder woman pilot that was also an agent of shield that was supposed to get our mockingbird. Oh, yeah, I was gonna make her wonder woman just to pay homage to the fact that she could have been wonder woman. That would have been fun. Uh, and then you know, god rest his soul. If he was still alive I would have used um, what's his name? To play batman again, to play kingdom combat. Oh, I would have used kevin conroy to play kingdom combat man again. Oh, man, yeah, that would have been great. Um, here's the most important casting in here. In my, in my humble opinion, this is the most important casting in here. Yeah, I feel like obviously you need to have, uh, norman mckay. Um, he's the narrator of this thing, he's the pov character.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's brian cranston by the way, go back and listen to our episode where we talked about kingdom come. Yes, incredible.
Speaker 1:So, yeah, this is the follow-up to this. Actually I realized. In live action b, brian Cranston plays Norman McKay. Yes, this religious man who is seeing you, know the world he knows and is questioning his religion and is thinking about that kingdom. Come Like. You know why I picked Brian Cranston? Because of Godzilla and the way that he was moving in. Godzilla, I feel, is the perfect approach. You just add the religious aspect onto it, of like and it's the same approach.
Speaker 1:It's like you're seeing these Titans rip the world apart and like you need to save your peace and like you need a bit of the old guard to come in and, like you know, set them right. And which goes into my last casting and probably one of the more important ones is who plays Magog. That which goes into my last casting and probably one of the more important ones is who plays magog. That's probably one of the more important pieces to it and that'd be austin butler. I think he has the physicality for it and he also has those like he has. He has the presence to be the front facing. I'm the hero of this situation, I'm saving everything. But like he can also flip it to be like I don't give a dang about any of these people out here. Do you think I care about any of these people? You people, no, Like I want you guys. If you die in the service of me being the world's greatest hero, that's fine with me.
Speaker 1:Like I think it would be a really cool approach. It's one of those things of like the same thing I feel about the Superman movie itself. Of like it's you know, quote, unquote the world the movie needs right now like kingdom come, it's the same thing like. I feel like this movie can be really well done. And that brings me into my personnel. I think jonathan nolan writing this makes the most sense. He's worked on these bigger I ideology movies like interstellar, yeah, um, obviously he worked with his brother on these films of like. I think he understands what the larger scale approach of a story like this would entail.
Speaker 2:And he would do it.
Speaker 1:And he would. And that's my, that's what I was trying to think of. Like who would do these things? Like I feel like if I told Maison, you get to have this like classic approach to these heroes, but like you can take your own spin, but this needs to like in the best possible, he would do it like, uh, once we do our wild card one, like somebody that would do it. But nolan, I think, would be jonathan.
Speaker 1:Nolan, I think, would be the best writer for this. Um, the cinematographer, I would get hoita van hoitama. Like I feel like again this larger scale, feel like this larger than life feel with this like added layer of realism on top of that, I feel like that's super important. Um, my composer, obviously would be han zimmer, which brings me into my last point of who would direct this. It's denis villeneuve, that's. Who is that? That's absolutely well, he might do it and that's the thing I feel like if you were to hand him every dc comic, this would be the one that he would take and be like I can do something with this like I can like I get.
Speaker 1:That was my denisville new one that was pretty good. I thought he was in the room, yeah like I feel like he would be like no, I can actually make something of this and like I can actually build a team of this but to me it's unfilmable the kingdom come is kind of unfilmable. That is a decently unfilmable film until see. That's why I kind of wanted to put g Frazier on here, but obviously he's busy doing Greg Frazier stuff.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:So, but I think Hoyt's kind of like I said and I'm saying this as if Greg Frazier didn't do Dune but there's like this like layer that I need on top of it that I think Hoyt can do. So, like I said, that's my personnel Like, like I said, like my favorite castings out of that was Josh Brolin as the older Batman. I like that a lot. Old man Batman, that's just I'm over it, man. I'm so sick and tired of you super-powered beings. You guys have ruined everything and I hate you.
Speaker 1:The Bryan Cranston one I'm really proud of is Norman McKay. I feel like he would be a really good conduit character and like a POV character for everybody as well too, something that's familiar to like everybody on Earth. Like Bryan Cranston would be good for that. And Austin Butler to kind of go against them as Magog. It not only gets him against the whole universe, it gets him against David Cornswet, which I think is a very good actor duo that can kind of butt heads with each other too. I love that.
Speaker 1:So thy kingdom come of, butt heads with each other too. I love that. So thy kingdom come. I think that would be like it'd be the last like this is the last dcu movie like this, is it like guns giving the keys to a person that's probably not even born yet and like do whatever you got to do, but we're doing. Kingdom come is like the last, like you know, and maybe what you can do is you take the, you take the special presentation and you lead it into Kingdom Come. Like this is like this is your ramp. But, like I said, kingdom Come is like just like play the hits man, play the freaking hits. Like play the hits of why it's the why of why we're doing all this and like why these characters are so important. So give me a wild card. What was the one? That you can do whatever you want me a wild card.
Speaker 2:What was the one that? Um, you can do whatever you want. Um, I just again, I'm kind of circling, I'm doing, I'm doing a symmetry and I'm bringing it all the way back to my original, my first pitch of this episode, and I'm just doing a flash rebirth thing crap. Guess what I also did flash rebirth is just does you just have grant gustin in it? Cause mine does. Yeah, it does. All right, cool, let's talk about it then yeah, let's, let's get into it. That's great, I love this.
Speaker 1:So we had the same idea, um, and you said, I mean you literally said anyone can do it, and I feel like think about James Gunn doing one of these movies. Why didn't I think about that? That's incredible.
Speaker 2:Um, and we just get, yeah, we just again. This is another thing where we can just play the hits, Cause that's literally what Flash Rebirth. Flash Rebirth plays the hits, um, and that's. I mean, you know that's. We can just kind of like just talk about what we would want to see from that, because we both have the same idea, which is awesome, also something that I think could happen in real life.
Speaker 1:I told you what I think the approach should be. He's building the Justice League Unlimited lineup. Yeah, wally West is probably going to be the DCU Flash, which leaves room for Grant Gustin to come back, and it makes sense and nobody questioned anything. He doesn't need to be the Arrow versus Flash. He can be that universe's Flash. That's what the multiverse is there for. I think this could happen in real life.
Speaker 2:I like it. What was your kind of conceit behind that?
Speaker 1:Okay. So what I really wanted to do was the same thing Flash rebirth. Just because I didn't get him as Johnny storm, I wanted Rudy Pankow to play from outer banks, to play Wally West. Okay, so, like this super, like you know, happy go lucky Wally West, that gets humbled a little bit too. And like I wanted it to be, this piece where, like Anthony star is the reverse, flash comes back and it's just like I, if I can't have barry allen, I'm going to systematically ruin your life. I'm going to ruin every aspect of your life I will kill everybody you love, like I.
Speaker 1:If I can't have, if I can't have barry allen, I'm gonna get the. I'm gonna get the one parading around as him. So I wanted a little bit of approach like that matt shackman's gonna write this for me. Who's gonna those gonna pull him from marvel and get him to write this?
Speaker 2:for me marvel.
Speaker 1:I think he can really hit the family aspect of this thing as well too. Um, and the close knit weave that that takes um the director, one, I think, was the most this was probably the most difficult one to think about. Um, it's gonna be joe kaczynski of the way he handles action and speed action obviously from top gun, maverick and f1. I think joe kaczynski of the way he handles action and speed action obviously from top gun, maverick and f1. I think joe kaczynski and tron legacy on top of that too, like I think he's the one that I think his approach is. The is is perfect for a flash movie. I feel like he can encapsulate a flash movie um trent renzer and atticus ross.
Speaker 1:I want this like. Obviously I'm high off challenger still, but I want this like. I want this. Like obviously I'm high off Challenger still, but I want this like. I want this like semi, like not techno, but I like, want this like, like, almost like beaded, like this, almost like beaded score to it, like a score that moves the way the flash would move, so like that was one I was thinking a lot about. I was like, I was like it's funny, all these projects have one person in it. It's just like you need to work for this whole thing to work. I don't know why Trent Renzer and Atticus Ross are the ones that need to work for this thing to work.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so, so, yeah, that's what I was thinking about for that one. I feel like it would be a fun little, you know, be like a fun little, like weird sciencey, like you know. Like I said, like I want it to be personal, I want the story to be personal, but I want to, I want to encapsulate, you know, the feel of the flash in here too, like that's something that this tv show I don't care what you say about the tv show, they get it like, they understand it. I don't care what you say that flash tv show understands barry allen. So I also want a big piece of this project. It's it's wally west. I need to know why wally west is so important to this whole thing and why he also is the flash. Yeah, what was your approach to this?
Speaker 2:I mean, you kind of, but go into it no, I mean, it was a similar approach to what to what yours was just kind of again.
Speaker 2:I think it mine would serve as like a celebration of of the character and and the actor, because I I think he got kind of again. I think mine would serve as like a celebration of the character and the actor because I think he got kind of shafted at the end of his whole run, especially leading into the Flash film, where it felt ripe for him to appear and he just didn't for some reason. You know, um, and I just feel like it feels like he has like a he, it feels like he does have some type of relationship with james gunn sure, I don't know what it is, but I feel like there is one there. So I just would bring him back and just give him like a celebration, like, and it it serves as this like very like meta commentary of like him returning and you're like, oh yeah, like he's back. You know, um, I also thought of Anthony star as the reverse flash, to be perfectly honest.
Speaker 2:I know I use them already, but I mean it's just. I mean I could either do that or I do the what's his name from Game of Thrones.
Speaker 1:Oh, jaime Lannister. Yeah, and I just let him do it. He was in the. That was the point of him being in the Flash, if I'm not mistaken. Yeah, that was the point. It was like the reverse Flash was there the entire time.
Speaker 2:And again, I just don't know what happened. One of those guys, guys, I just don't know what happened to his. Where did his career go? And I would bring him back to the proper Jamie Lannister-looking face, like clean-shaven, big blonde hair, and you just make him the reverse Flash in this movie and you just again just one final run where they just kind of go at each other. And that was kind of my idea for for it. I love it.
Speaker 1:I love it um, all right, so my wild card I'll do, I'll give you, I'll give you one more yeah, we did the same one, yeah, go ahead, we'll get one more, um.
Speaker 1:So I'm kind of thinking of jack kirby, because I like said on here, james gunn weirdly had the same, did the same thing Jack Kirby did, because Jack Kirby was with Marvel and he was just like blank, you, blank everybody, which James Gunn didn't do. He's definitely on good terms, but like they both left Marvel to go be the leaders of like they were, like you know, two guys on both sides, like at Marvel, that were like prominent to the point where DC picks both of them up and essentially turns them into the editors-in-chief. So I wanted to do a fourth world. Shout out Ava DuVernay, give her, and what I was going to do, I'm battling myself. So I have two approaches for director. I'll spoil one. One is let Ava DuVernay actually do it and, especially after Origin, I feel like she can do something, like she could always do something like that. Ava duvernay is one of the best directors in the world, um, but I feel like, especially after origin, the approach would be even, um, even stronger, um. So, like I said, you do the fourth world, you do the new gods.
Speaker 1:Dylan o'brien comes back, you get keith dav, you get Keith David to voice Darkseid. At least I feel like his voice would be so booming as Darkseid it would be. I love that Absolutely prominent. Obviously, you bring back Big Barda, bring back Elizabeth Debicki, a character to play or an actor to play. Orion is kind of what I was battling with as well, too. I was really trying to find the right person. I didn't want cameron monaghan. I don't know if he. I don't know if he fits in with dylan o'brien, like that was the one. Obviously I think they can fit together in something. I just don't know if it's the right approach. I feel like you need somebody a little bit more like like I'm the best son there is on planet earth, like you need somebody that's like kind of like a jerk, yeah, um, so that's why I was trying. That's where I was trying to get to. I think Jacob Elordi would get it kind of. He would get that Like I need to be the best son there is to do the thing.
Speaker 1:Um, harrison Dickinson also does that of like the, but Harrison Dickinson also, I think, can play the flash. That's why I was kind of battling with myself, umry allen's the flash specifically. But, um, but yeah, you do like this fourth world weird, wacky, like otherworldly, like this absolutely insane film that's like and this goes to my point about countering my director piece that only james gunn himself can pull off, and I think you just let james gunn not only direct this, but you let james gunn write this thing and like this is like I am jack, that's this, I'm jack kirby moment, which would be awesome. So, um, this is the one you might need greg frazier to do, this one you might need him to get be the creative one.
Speaker 1:We finally got him in yeah, you might need greg frazier to do this one, because this is too big, this is too large scale, like that. He, he, he's needed for this, he's needed. So yeah, um, so yeah, um, like I said, you get keith david to voice voice dark side, which also that's incredible casting. I love that also means keith david would voice dark side and and my mr miracle show like this would be like the mr miracle, like he's already voiced famed DC character, mr Bone.
Speaker 1:No, don't, no, but yeah, I think this would be like I said this, absolutely like out of left field, absolutely crazy. I had a third pick to do the To be the directors of this thing. It'd be the Daniels would be the third pick to do so, like, I feel like only they could be able to do something like this. That would also be great. I'm kind of three-way tying it. You know what I'll do. I'm going to stick with the Daniels because I think the scale of this movie, regardless of budgets, because that's what the Daniels are so good at they would just figure it out and be incredible at it. Just figure it out and be incredible at it. So I think the Daniels would be the perfect approach for this. I'll just keep the same son Lux to be the composer of this thing, just to stay consistent. And then, like I said, I think Greg Frazier takes a creative leap into the weird realm if that makes sense and goes along with them to try to pull off the scale of this thing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's awesome, I love that.
Speaker 1:Do the fourth world cowards?
Speaker 2:Yeah, we were close.
Speaker 1:Do the fourth world.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we were close.
Speaker 1:We were close. That movie was like done, not done, but shoot, it was getting there.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's a shame that one never got off the floor. Nice, I love that Again, I love our dynamic of me doing like the Remember. Yeah, I love our dynamic of me doing like the street-level stuff and you doing like the bombastic, like Gobbly, gobbly, yeah, yeah. Biggest swings there could possibly take. Yeah, I just love that again, like the second time we've done this and that's been consistent through line, which I think is really cool.
Speaker 1:I'd love to see our Star Wars one then, because that's the one we gotta get really creative on.
Speaker 2:I think that would be fun because obviously we have less to work with.
Speaker 1:It's less to work with. So the creativity and the personnel in Hollywood is going to get. The list is going to come bigger.
Speaker 2:Exactly. That's awesome. I love that Cool. I guess that's it.
Speaker 1:I guess we're done.
Speaker 2:Yep, we're going to. We're going to go watch Daredevil now. Yes, Episode three, which we don't know anything about. No stills, no trailers no, nothing so it's kind of like. This is like, it's almost like this is the first episode in a weird way because I felt like we kind of knew a lot of the stuff we saw in the first two episodes, we saw in the trailers. So this is kind of like new territory, which is awesome. I'm staying off of twitter, so yes me too.
Speaker 2:Um, so that's gonna do it for us this week. You can follow us on on twitter at project inf underscore pod. You can follow us on facebook. You can follow us on tiktok and youtube at the project infinite podcast. You can follow us on instagram at the project infinite pod. Next pod Next week? I don't know.
Speaker 1:We don't know, man.
Speaker 2:Maybe, maybe, like again, this Daredevil show could just devolve into Last of Us territory, where we just talk about Daredevil every week. Not that I would be mad at that, or I mean we can do Daredevil or we can talk about Spider-Man and do.
Speaker 1:Yes, Friendly Neighborhood Spider-Man.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we could do that for sure. We could talk about Invincible next week. Yes, there's a lot of stuff, we got stuff.
Speaker 1:Maybe it's an animation realm next week.
Speaker 2:Maybe that's kind of where we Because Invincible should be done this week. Right, friendly Neighborhood, spider-man is already done. So, yeah, maybe we focus on some of our animated shows next week and probably just a little like we kind of did this week, just kind of a little daredevil, kind of like what'd you think of this episode? So we'll do that.
Speaker 1:You know who's going to play Orion, and I think he has the look and the feel for it. It is going to be Javon Adepo. That was just caught in theyssey little. I think it plays to like he's actually dark side son as well too. So I think it plays on that a little bit as well too, and I think he carries like that hey, I'm, I'm orion. Like do the right thing, like shut up man nobody cares I don't know why I threw that out there.
Speaker 1:I was really trying to search for it. I was thinking about desmond idris to do it, like I said, just like a guy that's so pompous, like, oh Ryan, shut up, man, we don't care, and I wanted to play like that. We're done with the pitch meeting. Yeah, this is me kicking back open the door. Wait.
Speaker 2:James.
Speaker 1:I have one more thing. Wait, one more thing, one more thing.
Speaker 2:Cool, All From the Careful man.
Speaker 1:No no, no From the Am I just James Gunn Did it say James Gunn or Jack Kirby, both good options? Yeah, I hope they both didn't do bad things. Not that we know of Jack Kirby good guy. I hope so. He was yeah for everything that we know about him.
Speaker 2:He loves Marvel. He was like I'm done man. He did a lot of he did a lot of cool stuff. Yeah, he said no, I'm gonna do my own thing. Yeah. He did do his own thing Good for him. Um, all right, guys, that's it next week. Like I said, probably invincible little, invincible little Spider-Man Um.
Speaker 1:I think Invincibles biggest worry is they need to stick that landing Like they have to stick that landing to a point of like you have to pay the penance of what you did in season two, Like this is how important season three is to that show.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and Spider-Man.
Speaker 1:Man, what a surprise. What else they?
Speaker 2:did it again.
Speaker 1:They did it again and it's like I'm not even like the character of Spider-Man is like the character, Like I don't want. I want to talk about Lonnie Lincoln, Like that's the character I want to talk about really badly, Like what an absolute, incredible way to set a villain on an arc. Wow.
Speaker 2:Well, that's what I'm talking about. I was talking about the Secret Wars stuff, like when they remix 10, the remixing of the lore. When they do, it always seems to go pretty well. And this I mean this whole show, was a remixing of a lot of lore. In a lot of different ways.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:And I think they did a really really. It was a really really fun show and they did a really nice job, right. So we'll talk about that next week. Until then, we're going to enjoy some Daredevil Born Again, episode 3. We will see you next week. Goodbye.
